1.25GHZ is just overclocked 1GHZ

[theed]

The point is not the fact that the 1GHz and 1.25GHz chips use the same fab process. That's no big deal. It's made painfully obvious that the circuit diameter didn't shrink and the core voltage remained the same by the size of the heat sink and the consumed wattage. What pains me is the manner in which the material is presented. Both by posters here and by the link provided just above.

This is industry norm. Not industry freak. And should be represented as such. Also, the big difference between me overclocking my processor and Apple overclocking my processor is ... that it IS guaranteed by Apple. For a year. Or 3 for about 10% over the cost of the machine. What a guaranteed seller of chips says is the speed, is the speed. The facts are true, their presentation is severely flawed. This is an indication that moto isn't introducing new designs very fast. ... we know that already.

[ksv]

This thread consists of nothing more than arguments repeated over and over.

[MacLegacy]

hey ksv/boi, careful i'm the last poster now!

[chevy]

I am working in the semiconductor industry.

There is a difference between me overclocking my G3 from 300 to 400 MHz and Motorola testing the same chip under controlled conditition to rate it 300 or 400 MHz.

What we don't know here is who decided these G4 were good for 1.25 GHz. Did Motorola test these at 1.25 GHz (and deliver only to Apple), did Apple receive test info from Moto and use these accordingly, or does Apple just overclock and cool ?

Or is the speed limitation related to temperature, in which case just cooling down the die would allow for higher speed ? This would also be under control.

The only concern is that a device may be unreliable if it is operated outside its specification. We don't have the real specification of the device (only the published ones are available on Moto web site, but the real one may differ), neither do we have the test specification.... therefore all our discussion is... speculation.

[habilis]

I wholehartedly agree with not buying a new G4, and picking up a new pentium with XP. I just bought the new G4 Dual 1GHz with 1 gig RAM and jaguar and I'm utterly disturbed and profoundly disappointed with it's performance in every aspect. I used to be a Mac person, it's the sad truth, Apple has finally dropped the ball and gone south. We Mac people need to come out of our shell of denial about Jaguar. People need to know the truth about this. You can read my full report in the Opinion forum....

[ksv]

Originally posted by chevy
I am working in the semiconductor industry.

There is a difference between me overclocking my G3 from 300 to 400 MHz and Motorola testing the same chip under controlled conditition to rate it 300 or 400 MHz.

What we don't know here is who decided these G4 were good for 1.25 GHz. Did Motorola test these at 1.25 GHz (and deliver only to Apple), did Apple receive test info from Moto and use these accordingly, or does Apple just overclock and cool ?

Or is the speed limitation related to temperature, in which case just cooling down the die would allow for higher speed ? This would also be under control.

The only concern is that a device may be unreliable if it is operated outside its specification. We don't have the real specification of the device (only the published ones are available on Moto web site, but the real one may differ), neither do we have the test specification.... therefore all our discussion is... speculation.

Why should Motorola sell chips capable of running at 1.25 GHz rated at 1 GHz? That would just make less profit...
Motorola's chip's clock frequency ratings aren't related to temperature. Sure, cooling down the die allows the processor to run at higher frequencies, but I'd rather do that myself than paying $650 for Apple doing it.

[chevy]

You didn't get me right.

Either Moto only delivers to Apple because they have a contract to do so, or because Apple takes all the production at the best price, or because Apple accepts to pay a premium for extra testing and binning (sorting).

Or by cooling the chip Apple is able to run it faster. Managing the temperature of a component is not that easy ! And development of a new cooling scheme also costs, someone has to pay for it...

BTW, the only solutions for a much faster Mac now are:
Wider processing (64 bits or above)
New technology (faster clocks or parallel computing)
Distributed processing (Apple is already going this route with Quartz Xtreme), this is the option with the highest acceleration potential, but also the least versatile and probably the most expensive as all processors become specialized. This is the way biology is operating and it as been demonstrated to be quite efficient....

[ksv]

Originally posted by chevy
You didn't get me right.

Either Moto only delivers to Apple because they have a contract to do so, or because Apple takes all the production at the best price, or because Apple accepts to pay a premium for extra testing and binning (sorting).

Or by cooling the chip Apple is able to run it faster. Managing the temperature of a component is not that easy ! And development of a new cooling scheme also costs, someone has to pay for it...

If Motorola sorts out 1.25 GHz chips, they'd sell them as 1.25 GHz, not as 1 GHz. If Apple sorts them, the overall quality of the 1 GHz G4s is lower, and can't be overclocked as easily as pre-DDR G4 Macs, like I've said three or four times now
Cooling down a processor effectively isn't harder than using a peltier and a good fan. A peltier costs about $20. I'm sure I could clock a 1 GHz G4 way beyond 1.25 GHz for $650!
But, we can of course not say anything for sure until someone actually have checked the 1.25 GHz if they really are rated by Motorola at the speed they are running at.

I'm not saying Apple is doing anyhing wrong as long as their computers are stable, I'm just saying I'd rather buy a dual 1 GHz Quicksilver than a dual 1 GHz DDR.