Racial profiling - Page 4

**fryke** · #25 August 20th, 2006, 10:25 AM

Mikuro: Keep in mind that you can also have absolutely no security at all and almost no freedom at the same time. It's not _really_ such a linear thing. Seems to me freedom is currently stripped down in the name of a _false_ feeling of security.

Besides: This thread's subject is not about freedom (unless you mean a government's freedom to be racist...).

But the question again: Should we forget _all_ of our high morales just because of "but they did show me the tongue first!"-like points? I think not. Let's live by example and _still_ improve security. You don't have to invent racist ways to screen your passengers. Just screen them and make sure that your passengers are secure. I personally wouldn't want to be on a plane with, say, a hundred passengers of which only 20 have been screened well because of how they look. Not only because of the racism-issue, but also because I don't want to sit next to the pretty white French girl with the bomb. Although at crunch time, it might be the most interesting seat.

billbaloney · #26 August 20th, 2006, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fryke

Although at crunch time, it might be the most interesting seat.

Most likely in several ways.

**fryke** · #27 August 20th, 2006, 04:27 PM

Exactly.

Rhisiart · #28 August 20th, 2006, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fryke

Mikuro: Keep in mind that you can also have absolutely no security at all and almost no freedom at the same time. It's not _really_ such a linear thing. Seems to me freedom is currently stripped down in the name of a _false_ feeling of security.

Besides: This thread's subject is not about freedom (unless you mean a government's freedom to be racist...).

But the question again: Should we forget _all_ of our high morales just because of "but they did show me the tongue first!"-like points? I think not. Let's live by example and _still_ improve security. You don't have to invent racist ways to screen your passengers. Just screen them and make sure that your passengers are secure. I personally wouldn't want to be on a plane with, say, a hundred passengers of which only 20 have been screened well because of how they look. Not only because of the racism-issue, but also because I don't want to sit next to the pretty white French girl with the bomb. Although at crunch time, it might be the most interesting seat.

Sorry Fryke, but this reads as an example of armchair philosophy.

Yesterday, a Monarch plane leaving Malaga for Liverpool was prevented from taking off because passengers complained of two suspicious behaving Pakistanis on board. The British press quickly whipped up a storm in a teacup, suggesting that the airline and passengers over-reacted and were being hysterical.

It now transpires that the two individuals were behaving suspiciously, so much so that the pilots and flight crews were sufficiently concerned to stop the flight from leaving.

What I really take umbrage to is the idea that if you accept that there is a real war taking place (whoever is at fault) that being cautious is being racist. I don’t give a flying fig whether the threat are White Nazis or Asian Islamist extremists.

Having said this, I do actually agree to a point where you are coming from because you are a decent person. It's just a matter of pragmatism (I think!).

**fryke** · #29 August 20th, 2006, 05:03 PM

"armchair philosophy" alright. I can swallow that without a problem. The problem remains: If people start to allow torture based on the "qualities of the enemy", if racist tendencies are suddenly okay because "we're under pressure now" etc., this'd mean that _any_ of our values crumbles without a problem as soon as there's pressure. So why have values at all? If you only apply them in calm days, in your armchair, to go back to that picture, then those values are armchair values and hollow themselves. And I'd like _not_ to think so.

Where did you read into that I say being cautious is racist? If anything, I'm suggesting to be even _more_ cautious, because the next attack might be carried out by people who don't fit that racial profile.

Rhisiart · #30 August 20th, 2006, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fryke

Where did you read into that I say being cautious is racist?

No Fryke, you never suggested that. I meant it as a broad statement. Mind you, I stick with my armchair philosophy argument. But then, I also see your point of view too.

I'm so tempted to sit on the fence because your argument is essentially sound. However, I don't think the right thing to do is to hide my head in the sand. My views may be on the wrong side of the tracks, but there it is.

**fryke** · #31 August 20th, 2006, 06:06 PM

Okay. I can live with that.

(I kinda think this thread gave me a nice idea for a story I'm currently writing. 20 year old French blonde terrorist on the seat next to you in the plane. Sounds great. It has something. Sorry to bring that back again. I'm just mistreating my keyboard and writing quite a bit of text. Hopefully it'll be good when I'm done.)

reed · #32 August 21st, 2006, 12:11 PM

rhisiart,

It was a vey good list. I would have added a few more but I just wanted to lighten-up a bit this very serious situation that we are living. I forgot Global Warming on MY list by the way (is "Global Warming" in the dictionary now?). In a word, these things are connected. Think about it for a sec.
We will be controlled, filmed, filed and spied upon.A bit like "The Prisoner." Double checks at an airport is peanuts. I'm sure my shoe size is already known by the FBI.

SSLO......

No, towels are only an option. That's the fun part. This is the only organization I would join.....if they would accept me. Which I doubt. SIGH!!!

All the best.