The UK and America

[Qion]

It seems that with each passing week, I'm introduced to more despise and hatred from British people towards Americans. Whether it be on You Tube, the blogs I frequent, or simply on television, it seems that a fair number of people think America are a bunch of fat ignorant Christians with nothing better to do than eat cheese, watch American football, and generally wallow in their overblown patriotism and inflated egos from wars past.

I know that a fair number of people on this board hail from the UK, so please enlighten me. Our socioeconomic status here in America is frighteningly backwards, and a good number of hicks still believe in slavery, but we've places like New York and Silicon Valley where innovation and modernity is flourishing. Honestly, we're not all Christian, and over 50% of us disagree with Bush's foreign policy.

At any rate... please respond.

[Tommo]

I think that it is caused by an unfortunate stereotype image that people he have been exposed to. As in all countries a lot of peoples perspectives on other nationalities is a direct result of the portrait painted by the media, notably television rather than personal experience.

In the same way the British are regarded as a race of binge drinking hooligans by half of southern Europe who suffer a high level of British tourism. Indeed if some of our press is taken as gospel then a lot of Brits would feel that as well, but the majority of us are nothing like that.

These stereotypes have been around for quite a while, but it seems to be more acceptable now for people to express these views quite strongly, often hiding behind the anonymity of the internet. If I was to make a comment, America, rather than Americans, often comes across as wanting to run the world and have everything their own way, even with their allies which does influence some people's opinion..

Having been to America on a number of occasions, that is not the experience when you are there and I have always found the people very friendly and helpful with levels of service in shops, restaurants etc we can only dream of over here.

[Rhisiart]

American foreign policy sucks and the rest of America has to pay the price for this.

P.S. You know the old saying:

On the whole the Americans are bloody awful, but individually they are very nice, whereas on the whole the British are very nice, but individually are bloody awful.

A generalization of course.

[Giaguara]

In many places people think that internet is anonymous. So that they can express their hatred and ignorance when they are so anonymous (never mind their visits and IP are always logged to the server where they left the comment...) meaning they say things they would not say face to face. It's not just the UK, but at least their comments are easier to read as you won't need to learn a new language.

Now what would be interesting is if all the EU countries started to do as BS and long and painful processes for getting a visa, or even visiting ("how long are you going to visit? but I see you have been in Europe 3 years ago already... how are you going to sustain yourself?" etc etc). Even when the prices for everything for Europeans are going down, many don't want to visit US after previously having been treated inappropriately by the TSA. And it's sad that it's easier to bring a dog from abroad than a spouse (including Europeans, Canadians etc).

[Satcomer]

I can only speak from my experience as an older American. In my travels younger Frenchmen are the worst about thinking I am George Bush and want to vent on me even though I have said NOTHING to them! I am always just going to meetings I had to go to. In the UK this happened a lot less. Scotland was the best though. People there were kind and helpful when i was lost trying to find my way.

To me there seems to be a small youth culture emerging in the western EU that thinks it is fashionable to hate Americans.

I believe there are rude people ALL around the world.

[bbloke]

Interesting topic, Qion. A bit of a thorny one too! I'll try to give you a very honest picture of my experiences.

I think there is a combination of factors. One is that the British sense of humor can be quirky, and so a lot of comments can come across as being aggressive or insulting when they were not originally intended to be. I remember being told years ago that if British people insult you, it means they like you (friends tend to take the mick out of each other), but the worst situation was where they ignored you, which was a sign of indifference! That said, I realize there will be others out there who do mean things in a harsher sense.

There certainly are those who go by stereotypes of fat, sedentary Americans who have little understanding of the world outside their own borders. Then again, the UK has people like that too! There's plenty of unhealthy lifestyles in both countries. I also wouldn't worry about the "Christian" label, I think people are more specifically concerned about Protestant fundamentalism (e.g. teaching Creationism, etc.). While stereotypes do exist, I know plenty of Brits who enjoy travelling to the US or enjoy the company of Americans. It also reminds me of the English attitude towards the French; there's plenty of griping about them, but France is also a favorite holiday destination for many English people!

To be honest, I often find myself in the middle. I've often defended the US to people in the UK, to the point where they thought I was heavily pro-US. At other times, I've encountered very gung-ho people from the US, where I've been pointing out some of the less appreciated aspects of American culture or foreign policy, and then I'm seen as anti-US!

Over the years, there have been some gripes that have built up. When some (not all!) Americans adopt an attitude of boldly wading in and winning World War II for everyone, being the leader of the free world, or having a nation that everyone aspires to, it can get up people's noses. I think some Brits also feel a bit raw, particularly as the British Empire waned after the war, while American power increased, and Britain has only last year finished paying off its war debts to the US (the UK was quite devastated by the War, and the effects were felt for many years to come). More recently, many Europeans I have met feel increasingly uncomfortable about the spread of American culture and American business. While many welcome greater access to these things, there are fears that they must not override existing national characters.

To be honest, if you are noticing a rise in anti-American feeling, I think a lot of it comes from the Bush era. Bush has done America and Americans absolutely no favors abroad. He has done tremendous damage in the eyes of many (I believe the world's largest anti-war rallies was held during his era, etc.). I struggle to think of a time when the US was regarded with more suspicion abroad, and the US has unfortunately become, to many, the bad guy rather than the good guy. The rather simplistic "good versus evil" approach, and the fact that many US citizens are perceived to go along with it, rather strengthened the stereotypes you have alluded to. I remember an astonished debate in the media over here, when the question of "why do they hate us so much" was asked in the US after 2001; the question here was along the lines of how Americans could not know what has been done in their names for decades or, if they did, how they could not expect to be resented for it.

Many Europeans will also feel the world has been made a less safe place by them, due to this foreign policy, and that the policies were not well-founded in the first place. While some Americans refer to cowardly Europeans who won't step up to difficult tasks and who appease regimes, many Europeans will see current US foreign policy as being like a bull in a china shop, leaving a trail of destruction in its wake, and with the expectation that others will pick up the pieces. There is also perceived hypocrisy, when it comes to how America wants foreign nations to behave or comply with their wishes, but won't reciprocate (e.g. "The Hague Invasion Act," as it was referred to...). That doesn't help when it comes to adopting moral high-ground.

Anyway, the above are not necessarily my views, so please don't see it as an attack. I'm just trying to honestly relay what I think could be behind some of what you described. But, hey, perhaps Rhisiart was closer to the point and in far fewer words!

[Rhisiart]

I would add to this by saying that America and Britain have as many similarities as differences.

As bbloke rightly points out, we have many obese citizens in Britain too.

The US has crass TV, but in Britain we have a pathetically childish newspapers.

Many Americans have no knowledge of where places are in the world, but many Britons are just as geographically challenged.

Dubya recklessly went to war in Iraq, but the British Parliament backed him to the hilt.

If the British hate the Americans, why do so many radio DJs and TV presenters in Britain put on a false American accent (admittedly this is a little less common now).

America is a violent country full of hoods and rednecks, right? So how come London's crime rate has now exceeded New York?

For me Britain's going to hell in a handcart, which is a shame as most Brits are decent people. We seem to have imported the worst aspects of America, without importing the very best of the US.

P.S. Do I sound bitter?

[sgould]

I think that attitudes vary with the frequency of exposure to other cultures. In the UK nowhere is more than 75 miles from the coast. And the coast is where you meet people of different cultures. An american can travel 1500 miles and not meet anyone other than americans.

Our american friends, from the deep south, have travelled the world on military service. They reckon that the big problem is suspicion of the unknown, and that meeting people from different cultures and finding them to be friendly helps. Traditionally those places to meet were near seaports, but would now also be at airports and holiday resorts.

I'm on holiday in Italy at the moment, I'm 1000 miles from home. I've driven through eight different countries and had to communicate in three different languages. Everyone has been friendly and helpful. Trying to speak a few words in the local language helps too. It's amazing the number of people who cannot speak English until you have tried a "good morning" in their language first!!

In Venice we met a Nigerian, who says that London was the least racist place he has ever been to. Most other places he found less tolerant of people who are "different", and he has been travelling and working in Europe for five years.