questions on x-windows

**preemi** · September 8th, 2002, 08:05 PM

what up? sorry for my stupid question, but i am pretty confused.

anyways, i have been hearing of people running x on x. i have been reading a lot but cant put anything together. i have seen xfree86 for 10.1, but not for 10.2. i also discovered darwin is a totally stand alone os.

what i want to know, is how can i install some other window manager. should i install os x.1 and from the command line install xfree86 for darwin? or should i go with 10.2 and figure it out from there?

i know these are all very open ended questions, but i have recently been playing around with bsd and linux and now that os x has bsd, i run it as my portable web server. i would definitely like to learn how to get rid of aqua and install enlightenment or gnome but i have no clue where to start on the mac.

oh yea, is there any book in particular which covers this portion of mac os x? i am now so interested in doing this but i just dont know where to start.

thanks for all replies!!!

**symphonix** · September 8th, 2002, 10:42 PM

Okay, here's some clarification for you:

Darwin is the underlying system that drives Mac OS X, and while it is open source and available as a separate package, you really don't have to think about it as it is already part of your Mac OS X system.

XFree86 is a graphical-client-server that enables you to run apps in a GUI environment. It has the ability to 'pipe' its interface over a network, so if you run an X-windows app on a server, you can make it appear on your machine as the client.

Window Managers go on top of Xfree86 to provide you with effective control and a consistent "look and feel". A WM is responsible for providing the window-frames, the tools to handle them (such as minimising, roll-up, etc) and in some cases a full interface such as Gnome or KDE. On Mac OS X, you are likely to use the OroborosX WM because it imitates the look-and-feel of Mac OS X, and will wun seemlessly on the aqua desktop.

YOU DO NOT NEED TO GET RID OF AQUA in order to run X-Windows. You can run X-windows in its own environment (giving the impression of switching between Aqua and an X-Windows desktop) or you can run it right on top of Aqua. I myself use Gnome running right on top of Aqua. I have a Gnome menu-bar sitting just beneath the Apple menu, and can call up X-Windows programs right on my desktop, alongside Aqua programs such as office.

Finally, Fink is a very popular program for installing X-windows software ... it will make it all a whole lot easier, though you'll want a fast net connection or it'll take a while to download packages.
Alternatively, you can install XFree86, OroborosX and XDarwin from their install programs, which is ideal if all you really want to do is run a few remote X-windows apps. If you want more though, such as Gimp or Gnome, go with Fink.

**preemi** · September 8th, 2002, 10:48 PM

i see.

well one thing i am still wondering about is can i install the xfree86 package file on my 10.2 system? i guess i didnt clarify enough because i didnt really know what i wanted. i wouldnt mind running gnome on top of aqua, but i dont understand how i could do this. on my linux i have gnome but thats it, not aqua and gnome. is there a mac ported version of gnome that i could dl? or i may try gimp, but like i said, i know nothing of this.

thanks a lot for your info though i really appreciate it.
kevin

**symphonix** · September 8th, 2002, 11:16 PM

oops, I've confused you more. Gimp is the app I am most likely to run, it's an image editor (like photoshop), not a window manager.

I'm pretty sure that if you just download the latest version of Fink, the install should be right for 10.2. As for the packaged version, I think the one on apple's site (under macosx -> downloads -> unix utilities) is probably up to date, or you could chase up the latest at the X-Darwin page. If you're experimenting for now I'd suggest going with fink. Fink is a little harder (you'll need to enter a handful of commands in the terminal) but has a more complete set of utilities and applications.

As for window managers, gnome is pretty cool, but pretty slow to startup so I'd use it only if you want it 'always on' or if you've got a fast machine. If you need something slimmer, OroborosX or Icewm have their advantages (and all three are installed by fink). The heaviest WM is enlightnement, which has a lot of special effects at the cost of a little ease of use. I can't even remember what black-box was like.

Here's my .xinitrc file, which goes in your home directory. I've commented out the commands for other window managers. Just remove the comment symbol on any you don't want to run (delete the #) and comment the others.

# X-init (by Symphonix)
exec gnome-session
#exec blackbox
#exec icewm
#exec enlightenment

have fun!

**preemi** · September 9th, 2002, 04:41 PM

yea thanks a lot you really confused me !!!!

nah im just kidding. actually that info is very useful. what i am going to do rightnow is install os x.2 on my imac and then fink and figure that stuff out.

but seriously, thanks for the help. most people just say read a lot but i have been and im almost more confused now. but, ill start with fink and one of those managers you recommened and see where i end up. thanks again.

kevin