Inquirer/AmdZone/DigitalVideoEditing Opteron vs Apple/IBM G5

hulkaros

hulkaros

The Incredible...
Those sites making huge fun against Apple/IBM here:
http://www.digitalvideoediting.com/2003/06_jun/features/cw_macg5_interview.htm
here:
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=10547
and here:
http://www.amdzone.com/

The piece (95%) from The Inquirer:
"THERE'S A FUN interview with the Apple hierarchy over at Digital Video Editing.

After telling interviewee Charlie White all about Mac OSX and the G5, they're challenged about the statement that Apple has released the "first 64-bit desktop".

Charlie makes the Apple marketeers splutter when he mentions that BOXX shipped a dual processor 64-bit desktop on June 4th.

At first they try and tough it out, but then try and redefine the meaning of desktop.

Nor do the Apple folk seem aware that the Opteron is a 64-bit processor."

Even at AMD's own site Opteron is ONLY for Workstations/Servers and not for Desktops as seen (or not seen :p ) at AMD Desktops A-H here: http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ComputingSolutions/0,,30_288_3091_3098,00.html
Desktops I-Z: http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ComputingSolutions/0,,30_288_3091_3109,00.html
Opteron Workstation and Opteron Server solutions ONLY, here:
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ComputingSolutions/0,,30_288_3091_6340,00.html
and here:
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ComputingSolutions/0,,30_288_3091_3929,00.html

Even here:
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/0,,30_118,00.html?redir=HOM001
AMD makes CRYSTAL CLEAR that Opteron is Workstation/Server solution and not a Desktop one! What's next? Just because one can buy a 16-way server from IBM that too, is a Desktop system? :p

I emailed all those people to let them know what gives here:
newsdesk@theinquirer.net
cwhite@digitalmedianet.com
chris@amdzone.com

Pics of my replies will be here soon...
http://homepage.mac.com/hulkaros/ePic1.jpg
http://homepage.mac.com/hulkaros/ePic2.jpg
http://homepage.mac.com/hulkaros/ePic3.jpg

If you feel like it, you too, let them know your take on the subject...

They are absulotely scared those Wintel/Amd people about the G5 and Apple in general! On one hand I totally enjoy it but on the other hand it makes me :mad: I cannot wait for my Dual G5/2GHz! :cool:
 
Hey dude,

I've read the interview to the end and the apple/ibm guys come out very well, even the interviewer admitted that he wanted one. The fact that these other sites have picked out one small (and incorrectly informed) part of the interview just advertises their own ignorance.

They are worried that Apple now has a competitive chip and architecture and will successfully hold on to (maybe even expand out of) the niche markets that Intel and AMD are trying to move into.

An opponent is always at their most dangerous when cornered, until recently, Apple was cornered. Now all Apple has to do is make this advantage stick! :)
 
Let me say a few words about Charlie White...

First off, he's a very credentialed individual. But his bias against Apple is so thick you'd need a army core of engineers to cut through it.

Read his article on Premiere Pro. The man is clearly giddy with Premiere Pro not being available for the Mac. You can almost feel his grin getting wider as he gouds the Premiere publicist in to detailing Adobes drop of the Mac (in part 2 of the interview, here.
 
It really depends upon how liberal your definition of "desktop systems" is. How do you define a desktop? The SGI Indy that I use daily is a 64-bit system. When SGI started shipping them back in 1993 they were running on 64-bit processors. By about 1995 SGI had a 64-bit OS for them. I have Gimp, Photoshop, Illustrator, Acrobat Reader, Netscape Communicator, AbiWord and a handful of games on it. It is smaller then the Power Macintosh 6100 that came out about the same time. I could use a Palm (via one of two Apple serial ports in the back) with it. I could use a Zip Drive (via SCSI-2 with HFS formated disks) with it. It doesn't seem to have any problems seeing my LaserWriter printer. Other then the fact that it was sold as a workstation it could just as easily be a desktop system.

On the other hand IRIX is by definition a workstation/server OS, not a consumer OS. Mac OS X is a consumer OS that can be used as a workstation OS. Windows NT 4.0 Workstation is a workstation OS. Windows 2000 Professional is a workstation OS. Windows XP Professional is a workstation OS. BOXX sells their systems with either Windows 2000 Professional or Windows XP Professional and calls them workstations. Given that, how are these systems supposed to be desktop systems?

So if we look at the lines in the interview everyone is talking about:

Charlie White: Now, you're saying it's the first 64-bit desktop machine. But isn't there an Opteron dual-processor machine? It shipped on June 4th. BOXX Technologies shipped it. It has an Opteron 244 in it.

Rubinstein: Uh...

Akrout: It's not a desktop.

Charlie White: That's a desktop unit.

RacerX: Not according to BOXX Technologies, they aren't.
 
A bit more info... Straight from Boxx here:
http://www.boxxtech.com/asp/opteron.asp
or here:
http://www.boxxtech.com

BOXX themselves say that they sell Opteron Workstations and Servers! ::ha:: ::ha::

In this blind hatred against Apple/IBM's G5 from those PROs it is not depending on the definition of what is Desktop/Workstation computer... If according to AMD AND BOXX, Opteron is for Workstations and above those PROs should back off and take some PRO lessons :mad:

If I can afford to buy a 16-way computer and use it for Solitaire that doesn't make that computer a Desktop, does it? :p

To jazzyjim:
Actually, as serpicolugnut said (and from what I know) that guy is against Apple in every change he gets... :mad: Oh, and Welcome here ;)
 
Please, people, calm down... It's all marketing, isn't it... I need a computer in order to do my graphics design work. Do I have to decide whether I want a workstation or a desktop machine? Nope. I need a fast machine capable of running Photoshop, InDesign, Illustrator etc. Both of those machines can do that. WHAT defines a workstation? WHAT defines a desktop? Isn't a PowerMac G5 pretty much a workstation?

I'm pretty sure I don't care as much as you do, hulkaros... :/
 
Originally posted by fryke
Please, people, calm down... It's all marketing, isn't it... I need a computer in order to do my graphics design work. Do I have to decide whether I want a workstation or a desktop machine? Nope. I need a fast machine capable of running Photoshop, InDesign, Illustrator etc. Both of those machines can do that. WHAT defines a workstation? WHAT defines a desktop? Isn't a PowerMac G5 pretty much a workstation?

I'm pretty sure I don't care as much as you do, hulkaros... :/
Click to expand...

...what you are saying Fryke if only there weren't out there SO many people going against Apple in every chance they get and we were living in a utopia where all computer platforms were co-existing happily ever after! :rolleyes:

The worst part is that those supposedly PROs are the ones who "educate" the masses and not you or any other computer-peacemaker out there... :(

If Apple says G5 is a Desktop and AMD/Boxx say that Opteron is Workstation/Server why me, you or anyone else try to say otherwise? :p

And I think we all know that the real problem isn't if G5/Opteron is Workstation, Desktop, whatever but how some PROs sites and their people try to spread Apple FUD THAT much while at the same time making fun of us :mad:
 
The reply of AMDZone to me:
"You sir are a fool, and are not qualified to comment."

Another professional example of them! :rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by hulkaros
The reply of AMDZone to me:
"You sir are a fool, and are not qualified to comment."

Another professional example of them! :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
I believe AMDZone is a fan site, not a commercial entity, so I'm not surprised at all by their response. To be fair, everyone throws dirt around. Hell I've walked out of some Mac sites covered in mud.
 
Nitpicking. These pundits are just nitpicking. Picking nits. Looking for any scrap of dirt against the G5 and Apple.

Today's workstation is tomorrow's desktop which is the next day's PDA. It's just a word. As for 64-bit, Apple might as well be saying they have first box with a metal grill front. It's meaningless at the time being, just like DDR-RAM was meaningless in the last G4 models. This, of course, will all change over time, but for now it's just hype and a way to sell more boxes.

In the end, the proof will be in the pudding. The G5 either will or will not live up to expectations and there will be no arguing it. You can't argue launch times, render times and disk access and those are the things I'm interested in (in additon to a preferred OS experience).

I am optimistic that the G5 will stand on its own against the very best chips. We will still continue to have to listen to the nitpickers talk about how the G5 is slightly slower than the Intel in some test or another or how it only gets 500 fps in Quake instead of 550, but I wil not care because I will be running a great OS on a great box, making money and having fun.
 
Charlie White is a bit of an anti-Mac zealot. His poorly written article clearly demonstrates that.

I have not seen the latest update to Premiere, but if it is as good as he says it is, this could be an issue. Apple has not shown any signs of complacency when it comes to FCP, but if Premiere is clearly equal, then Apple does have a possible fight on it's hands.

White also makes a good point about compeition on the Mac. With three major tools, it will still be a competitive market, but if Apple slacks off or if Avid were to drop support, it could make the choice of Apple a harder sell to bean counters.

Of course, if Photoshop came out as a Mac-only tool, I wonder how many Windows users would jump ship to the Mac?
 
Originally posted by pyroboy
Of course, if Photoshop came out as a Mac-only tool, I wonder how many Windows users would jump ship to the Mac?
Click to expand...

Funny, originally Photoshop was Mac-only. The first version for Windows was 2.5.
 
Well, that solves the laptop G5 mystery... looks like we aint seeing those for a while...
btw hulkaros, I sent you a PM a couple days ago if you didn't see it :p
 
Man, I really have to walk a fine-line here...

Being an IT Tech and Mac Lover I can get clobered by one or more of three sides in an instant...

I was out buying PC parts with a client and basicaly let him tell me what *HE* wants and I keep my mouth shut to what CPU should be in his new computer (he asked what the difference was between Intel and AMD, and knows I have a Mac as primary computer).

He went with an Intel PC and I bit my lip... Altho my entire soul screamed "APPLE!!!" or at least AMD!

I get to pocket some money for myself, so I'm happy either way. :)
 
OK, here's how it boils down to me:

Apple G5:
Dual 2.0GHz
1GB PC3200 DDR Ram
250GB Serial ATA Drive
ATi Radeon 9600 Pro
56k V.92 Modem
SuperDrive (DVD-R/CD-RW)
Apple Keyboard and Mouse
Mac OS X
--------------------------------
$3,374.00



Boxx Tech:
Dual Opteron 244
1GB 2700 DDR Ram
nVIDIA Quadro 64MB
200GB 7200 RPM ATA Drive
Pioneer DVD-R
3 rear ports IEEE1394
Windows XP Pro
Keyboard/Mouse
----------------------------------
$4,264.00
 
Originally posted by MaC hAcKeR
Well, that solves the laptop G5 mystery... looks like we aint seeing those for a while...
btw hulkaros, I sent you a PM a couple days ago if you didn't see it :p
Click to expand...

If you could elaborate more on the HULK :rolleyes: because here in my country Greece, HULK is not out, yet! :mad:

I hope that you people enjoyed or will enjoy "my" movie :D or else :p
 
Originally posted by Sogni
Man, I really have to walk a fine-line here...

Being an IT Tech and Mac Lover I can get clobered by one or more of three sides in an instant...

I was out buying PC parts with a client and basicaly let him tell me what *HE* wants and I keep my mouth shut to what CPU should be in his new computer (he asked what the difference was between Intel and AMD, and knows I have a Mac as primary computer).

He went with an Intel PC and I bit my lip... Altho my entire soul screamed "APPLE!!!" or at least AMD!

I get to pocket some money for myself, so I'm happy either way. :)
Click to expand...

2-3 months ago I was working in a company which was selling both Macs and Wintels/AMDs and everyday I had this problem... I wanted to tell all customers to buys Macs but I couldn't :rolleyes:

But the difference between you, I and most people here on www.macosx.com is that we do not get read or heard by thousands of possible consumers every day like those PROs... :mad:

BTW: Nice pics you got there... What about your PowerMac? Would you "upgrade" it to a G5? :D
 
Originally posted by hulkaros

BTW: Nice pics you got there...
Click to expand...
Thanks. :D


What about your PowerMac? Would you "upgrade" it to a G5? :D
Click to expand...

It's tempting... but I want to get a PowerBook. I can't sit behind a desk for too long (leg pain from surgery), and I need portability in a bad way! Especially since doc mentioned the possibility in yet another operation! Ugh! :(
 
Originally posted by Sogni
...It's tempting... but I want to get a PowerBook. I can't sit behind a desk for too long (leg pain from surgery), and I need portability in a bad way! Especially since doc mentioned the possibility in yet another operation! Ugh! :(
Click to expand...

In that case a PowerBook will be more than fine and I think that you should prefer a portable anyways just to let your leg heal faster without stressing it...

I hope that your leg problem will be solved without the need of another operation! :(

Good luck and keep it up! :cool:
 
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