# Linux for 68k Mac



## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 13, 2009)

I would like to know if there is a floppy linux for a PowerBook 520c?  I know it won't be much (no GUI, basic commands) but it is better that nothing.  I need it to run on floppy because all of the hard drives I have don't work.


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## MisterMe (Feb 13, 2009)

Try this or that.


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

What about a sort of DOS (Disk Operating System) for the PB?  If there is none is it possible to edit a version of System 7 or change part of the linux kernel?  I have a Mac OS system on floppy using a miniFinder called Substitute but I rather use the command line than that.  Any ideas?


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## nixgeek (Feb 17, 2009)

AFAIK, there has never been any sort of DOS-type operating system available that would run on either a 68K or PPC Mac.  You would have to run some sort of free Unix clone like either Linux/m68k or NetBSD/68k.  You might have better luck with NetBSD on a 68K Mac and there are a few people that are running that on their 68K Macs for use as webservers, but it does take a little more work to configure than a 68K port of GNU/Linux (like Debian).


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

Does anyone know where you can get System 7 Pro?


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## ElDiabloConCaca (Feb 17, 2009)

System 7 "Pro"?  I had no idea they had a "Pro" version of System 7...


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

ElDiabloConCaca said:


> System 7 "Pro"?  I had no idea they had a "Pro" version of System 7...


It is the same as System 7.1.1.


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

Has anyone heard of Mac06?  I'm trying to get this to run off floppy.


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## nixgeek (Feb 17, 2009)

#1 Rhapsody said:


> Has anyone heard of Mac06?  I'm trying to get this to run off floppy.



I used it once a loooong time ago, but didn't find any real use for it.  I was new to anything Unix or POSIX at the time, so i guess that would explain it.  All I was able to do was navigate back and forth through directories.


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

Can you format a Mac floppy as a higher capacity than 1.44 MB?  You have the option when making a disk image with Disk Copy, but I can't get it to write to floppy.
Also can you boot from multiple floppies?  Like put in one disk, load it into RAM, then insert another disk.


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## ElDiabloConCaca (Feb 17, 2009)

#1 Rhapsody said:


> Can you format a Mac floppy as a higher capacity than 1.44 MB?


This is determined by the type of floppy disk, not the operating system.  A 1.44MB floppy holds 1.44MB of data on a Windows computer, and a Mac computer, and a Linux computer.  Likewise an 800k floppy holds 800k of data, regardless of platform.  It's not the Mac that determines that the floppy holds 1.44MB, it's the floppy that determines that the floppy holds 1.44MB.

The same as a 500GB hard drive -- it holds 500GB no matter whether you use it with a Mac, a PC or a Linux box.  You can't magically format a 500GB hard drive and have it hold more than 500GB, say, like 750GB.  The drive is 500GB.  You get 500GB, no matter what kind of computer you use it with.


> Also can you boot from multiple floppies?  Like put in one disk, load it into RAM, then insert another disk.


No.  Not unless the boot process of whatever you're booting allows for it.  If it's an operating system that originally did not have that capability, then no, you can't do it.


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## fryke (Feb 17, 2009)

Actually, there were methods on various platforms to actually format floppies a little higher than advertised. I remember having 920 KB on an 800K disk and 1.6 MB on a 1.44M disk. Sometimes formatting disks that way resulted in flakey behaviour, but most of the time it worked. Still: You wouldn't gain much.


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

What about booting from multiple floppies?


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## ElDiabloConCaca (Feb 17, 2009)

fryke said:


> Actually, there were methods on various platforms to actually format floppies a little higher than advertised. I remember having 920 KB on an 800K disk and 1.6 MB on a 1.44M disk. Sometimes formatting disks that way resulted in flakey behaviour, but most of the time it worked. Still: You wouldn't gain much.


True... I had a DOS utility back in the day that allowed me to format 1.44MB floppies to 2.0MB.  Some floppies worked, some didn't.  The program used the sectors on the very outside of the ring (which are normally marked unusable since it was difficult to ensure that they worked as well as inner sectors) -- and success depended upon whether a particular floppy's outside rings were up to par.

I agree: you were destined to run into flakiness at some point.

Still, I guess my point was that it's not platform-dependent.  If I could format a floppy to 2.0MB on a DOS box, I could theoretically do the same on a Mac or Linux box.  Whether or not the software tools exist to do so on such platforms is, in my opinion, irrelevant, because it's the media itself that governs how much data it can hold, not the operating system.

I don't think you can boot from multiple floppies... I mean, yes, theoretically, you could have a hardware RAID of floppies or something equally crazy, but still... the point being it's not easy to boot from multiple floppies unless specifically supported by the installation software on the floppies.


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

I've used multiple floppies to run floppy linux on PCs before.  Why couldn't you do it with a Mac running linux?


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

What about Unix for 68k Macs?  The only one I've found is Mac06 but I can't get it on a floppy along with my modified boot disk.


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## MisterMe (Feb 17, 2009)

#1 Rhapsody said:


> I've used multiple floppies to run floppy linux on PCs before.  Why couldn't you do it with a Mac running linux?


You could if it existed. Unix-based systems including Linux are comprised of more than simply the kernel. The kernel is quite small and can fit on a single floppy. The distribution would be configured with the supporting utilities fit on the other floppy.

The problem with running Linux on a Mac from multiple floppies is finding a Mac with multiple floppies. My first Mac was a Mac SE with dual 800K floppy drives. This 1987 vintage computer was discontinued in 1990. IIRC, the last Mac available with dual floppies was the Macintosh IIfx. It went on to its great reward in 1992. Of course, external drives were available, but you get the idea.


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 17, 2009)

What about MacMinix?  Does anyone know where to download it?


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## ElDiabloConCaca (Feb 17, 2009)

#1 Rhapsody said:


> I've used multiple floppies to run floppy linux on PCs before.  Why couldn't you do it with a Mac running linux?


You could, if that same distro of Linux also made boot disks for 68k Macs.

Like I said, if the boot media supports it, then you can do it.  If it doesn't, you can't make it (without some serious work).


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## nixgeek (Feb 17, 2009)

According to thei respective system requirements, neither Debian/m68k nor NetBSD/m68k might be able to run on your 520c because of possible issues with floating point emulation on the 68LC040 chips that some Macs use.

http://www.debian.org/ports/m68k/

http://ftp.netbsd.org/pub/NetBSD/Ne...68k System Requirements and Supported Devices

That said, it's still worth a try to see if you can successfully install either of them.


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## MisterMe (Feb 18, 2009)

#1 Rhapsody said:


> What about MacMinix?  Does anyone know where to download it?


Let me Google that for you.


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 18, 2009)

Do you need the Powerbook software that comes with System 7.5 installed to boot using battery?  I used Apple's Intelligent Battery Reconditioning Software to recondition the battery but I can't get it to boot.  I followed the instructions here.
Also, does anyone know of good games and apps for System 7?

Thanks,
#1 Rhapsody


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 19, 2009)

Anyone??


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## nixgeek (Feb 19, 2009)

Regarding the PowerBook software, I'm not quite sure.

As for software in general for System 7, have you checked out Pure Mac?  There's also System 7 Today


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## nixgeek (Feb 21, 2009)

#1 Rhapsody, check out this site which is running on a PowerBook 520:
http://coius.dyndns.org:8080/index.html

That PowerBook is using the same software I'm using for my site, which is hosted on a Quadra 650:
http://mirandafam.ath.cx


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 25, 2009)

I've pretty much given up on the laptops.  I only other thing I could think of would be is to make a RAM disk to uncompress the kernel on then boot into the kernel while getting the file system of another floppy.

What about learning Unix in Mac OS X?  I have an iBook that isn't used much so it would be perfect.  Is there a kind of program that will let you learn commands without the possibility of messing Mac OS X up?

Thanks


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## fryke (Feb 25, 2009)

On an intel Mac you could use virtualisation to run some linux distro in a sandbox. On an up and running OS X, you definitely _can_ hose the system by working in the Terminal. But if you're careful, you won't. You don't _have_ to run "sudo rm -rf /". You can imagine what it does after you've used "sudo rm -rf" on a simple directory that you won't miss. A good O'Reilly book might help as well.

But if you don't really use the iBook much, there's no real harm. Just reinstall OS X if you ever mess up...


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## nixgeek (Feb 25, 2009)

If you're going to try on your iBook, then there are a lot more options:

_GNU/Linux_

*Ubuntu* (pick the Alternate Install): http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ports/releases/intrepid/release/
*Fedora*: http://fedoraproject.org/en/get-fedora-ppc
*Debian* (I linked to the netinstall which is smaller, but it requires an active internet connection.  Just scroll down for the "stable" image and click on "powerpc"): http://www.debian.org/CD/netinst/
*openSUSE*: http://software.opensuse.org/

_BSD:_

*FreeBSD*: ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/powerpc/ISO-IMAGES/7.1/
*OpenBSD*: http://openbsd.com/macppc.html
*NetBSD*:http://www.netbsd.org/ports/macppc/


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 25, 2009)

I installed some updates on my iBook then rebooted and now it won't boot, it just sits at the Apple icon screen with no spinning wheel.  What do I do?  It does this sometimes then when I check later it will boot.

Edit:  I let it sit and it finally booted.  Why would it do this?


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## nixgeek (Feb 25, 2009)

#1 Rhapsody said:


> I installed some updates on my iBook then rebooted and now it won't boot, it just sits at the Apple icon screen with no spinning wheel.  What do I do?  It does this sometimes then when I check later it will boot.
> 
> Edit:  I let it sit and it finally booted.  Why would it do this?



Is this under OS X, GNU/Linux, or the BSDs?


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## Mikuro (Feb 25, 2009)

#1 Rhapsody said:


> I installed some updates on my iBook then rebooted and now it won't boot, it just sits at the Apple icon screen with no spinning wheel.  What do I do?  It does this sometimes then when I check later it will boot.
> 
> Edit:  I let it sit and it finally booted.  Why would it do this?



Since around 10.4, OS updates have required two restarts. After the first restart it just sits there giving you no visual feedback for a long time, then restarts again and loads normally. It's alarming, but normal.

I wouldn't be surprised to see it take 5-10 minutes on an older system.


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## #1 Rhapsody (Feb 25, 2009)

nixgeek said:


> Is this under OS X, GNU/Linux, or the BSDs?



It was under X.  There is no program that will let you use OS X's built in Terminal in a sandbox?


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