# Do you like the dock?



## Biff (Feb 22, 2002)

I have heard a lot of mixed feelings about the dock. What do you think of it?


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## kenny (Feb 22, 2002)

I had to say neutral. I like it, but I don't think it's wonderful. I'd just as soon have the old apple menu and task switcher from pre-X instead. But it is nice to have live icons on the dock. I run a CPU monitor (Xload) in the dock that's quite nice, and ASM helps bridge the gap.

If there'd been a selection for "I like it, but it could be better", I'd have chosen that...


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## simX (Feb 22, 2002)

Well, besides the obvious one, here's how to get the old functionality back:

1.  Make a folder.

2.  Drop all the Apple Menu Items you want into it.

3.  Make the custom icon of the folder a multi-colored Apple logo.

4.  Drag it onto the right side of the Dock.

This is the EXACT functionality of the Apple menu (without the memory usage thing) in the Dock, with a larger, more beautiful icon.  You can't complain about the lack of Apple menu, because here it is.


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## sfsheath (Feb 22, 2002)

Unless I'm mistaken, you don't get hierarchical menus for the folders that are in folders placed in the dock so it's not the exact same functionality.

 -Sebastian


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## Nummi_G4 (Feb 22, 2002)

I like the dock but I do not... I think the OS 9 app switcher was great cause it was hidden up in the menu bar... a space that is already taken... the dock can hog some valuable space.  when I am in photoshop, I need every last pixel I can get.  I know you can make the dock "hide", but it pops up when you do not want it to.


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## unlearnthetruth (Feb 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by sfsheath _
> *Unless I'm mistaken, you don't get hierarchical menus for the folders that are in folders placed in the dock so it's not the exact same functionality.*



I get hierarchical menus for folders...

unless i misunderstood ya  

forgive the HUGE register thingie... i forgot about that, lol... but you get the idea


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## changomarcelo (Feb 23, 2002)

One of the things I missed from Windows when I bought my first Mac with OS 9, was the task bar, where I can switch applications quickly. In OS 9 I had to pull down a mini-menu first, choose the application, and then choose the window from the window pull down menu... A lot of work that I was used to do with only one click in windows.,
The dock simplified it a lot. Just right clic on an icon (or CONTROL+Clic for those who have a one button mouse) and choose the window you want to work.
HOwever, I think it just could be better. For example, when you press COMMAND+TAB, the sequence goes throug all programs, but it would be better if the secuence started in the last active programa, so you could do COMMAND+TAB only once to switch between two applications you are working on it (yes, like Windows).
Just  one last thing: We shoul make a poll to know where do we use the dock most (right, left or bottom).


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## kenny (Feb 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by simX _
> *Well, besides the obvious one, here's how to get the old functionality back:
> 
> 1.  Make a folder.
> ...



Yes, I know about that, and I do it, but I have to disagree slightly that it's exactly the same as the old Apple menu. It's very very close, but there are 2 problems with it:

1. It's slower - both to use and to manage. Without spring-loaded folders, I have to open it, and have the window to the original item open to drag over an alias. Before, I could just spring down the hierarchy to put the alias where I wanted. Also, there's a delay in displaying the contents of it, even if all the items are aliases. If the aliases are only the folders (like Applications), the delay is even worse. I'd be willing to trade off some memory useage for the responsiveness of the old way. 

2. It's in the wrong place. There was a reason that the Apple menu was were it was in the first place. The Human Interface Guidelines which, in a cruel twist of irony, Apple originally wrote but now apparently ignores, had something to say about the placement of elements on the screen (or a dialog). It's so simple, but it makes so much sense.

Put simply, the HIG said that when looking at the screen, the most important elements should start at the upper left, and proceed in importance diaganally to the lower right. So, the elements of "What programs can I run" and "what programs are running" and even "what time is it", having been arranged to be at the top of the screen, were in the right places. Strictly speaking, "what programs can I run" had a very slightly more important meaning than "what programs are running", but it's negligable. Proceeding down and to the right, the least important element was "what's in the trash". That is also correct, since it is, after all, the trash.

On a stock X system, all three of these are either in the wrong places or ignored altogether. The trash is actually in the wrong place, being more toward the center-bottom. With the right-side preference for the placement of icons on the desktop, a new file on the desktop can, depending on its placement have a lower importance than the trash. This is easily corrected by pinning the dock end while having the dock either on the bottom or right.  ASM (see version tracker) puts the application switcher back at the top right, where it belongs, with a minimum of fanfare or hassle. But the Apple menu is still a problem, essentially MIA. I know about FruitMenu, but the last time I used it, it was so buggy as to be useless (the menu hierarchies kept switching, rendering any muscle memory building pointless). Perhaps I should check to see if there's an update that fixes some of that.

It's interesting to note that Windows' placement of these elements are, again, by default, completely backward. I've found that putting the taskbar at the top and moving the Recycle bin to the lower right helps a great deal with Windows. It's not perfect, but it feels a lot better. I noticed a coworker (who has, interestingly, never used Macintosh) of mine had put the taskbar on top, and I asked him why he'd done that. He couldn't explain it except to say that it seemed to work better for him that way. How many other millions of Windows users are subconciously struggling with the bad placement of UI elements?

All that said, I am getting used to the Dock, and as I said before, the ability to have live icons (CPU monitor, network monitor, boucing icons, etc.) is a very good thing. I just wish that the fundamentals hadn't been lost to gain that.

I know that an awful lot of folks will feel that I'm picking nits here, and that may be true, but before they flame me for all this, I hope they answer one very basic question for me. Beyond the HIG and notions of UI design, why, in a system thats been so customisable in the past, shouldn't I expect to be able to get the system to work the way _I_ want it to?

This question also extends to theming the OS, but that's a different thread.


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## unlearnthetruth (Feb 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by me _
> *forgive the HUGE register thingie... i forgot about that, lol... but you get the idea *



sorry about that - it was referring to a snapz shot of hierarchical menu's in action out of my dock, but apparently the photo was too big or something. oh well!


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## wtmcgee (Feb 23, 2002)

it's not perfect, but i do like it a lot.  looks beautiful, functional.... sometimes i wish there was more room though (or an additional dock as some have mentioned)


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## Biff (Feb 23, 2002)

I like it myself however it needs more work. I think that one dock for running applications and their minimized windows and another dock for storage of recently used applications/folders would be a good idea. This would be the same idea behind the NeXT style dock. With all that more user control would probably be a good idea. ie more control over the behaviour and position of the dock(s).


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## edX (Feb 23, 2002)

If this question had been asked a week earlier i probably would have answered neutral. I still wish they would bring back the launcher. But having recently bought Dockswitcher for $3, i now have all the docks i need. there is even a free one that gives you just 2 docs. In the end this works just like the launcher plus i can keep them hidden. switching is fast and easy. and while it would be nice to see apple include multible docks and more options for how they are used, $3 has solved the issue for now. I regularly spend that much on items that don't last thru the day.

just visit www.macupdate.com and/or www.versiontracker.com and search for 'dock'.  Setting them up for the first time is a bit of work but after that they work great.


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## adambyte (Feb 23, 2002)

Mine's currently at the bottom, simply because when icons are bouncing, it makes sense for the gravitational pull of the earth to make them bounce up and down.

Hey, Kenny, I agree whole-heartedly with your human interface ideals. Using System 7.1 always felt like a very clean, well organized experience... (except when my dad loaded the Apple menu with dozens of items, but that's another story...)

So, based on the Apple human interface guidelines, what would be the ideal position and pinning for the dock?


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## kenny (Feb 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by adambyte _
> *Mine's currently at the bottom, simply because when icons are bouncing, it makes sense for the gravitational pull of the earth to make them bounce up and down.
> 
> Hey, Kenny, I agree whole-heartedly with your human interface ideals. Using System 7.1 always felt like a very clean, well organized experience... (except when my dad loaded the Apple menu with dozens of items, but that's another story...)
> ...



Heh... I keep my dock at the bottom and end-pinned (so that the trash is always in the lower-right). I never thought about the gravity thing, but it makes perfect sense to me... 

I had occasion to use a 7.1 machine just yesterday, which is probably what fueled part of my rather lengthy post earlier. It's just so much less cluttered than what we've gotten used to with later versions of the OS.

There probably isn't an 'ideal' location or pinning for the dock, given the shortcomings that it imposes. Others have mentioned, here and in other threads, certain stupid dock behaviours (icons jump out of its way even if it's hidden, on the right for instance, but windows do not, so it ends up obscuring buttons or the resize widget), making its placement very tricky to not interfere with anything. And, of course, given its function, anywhere other than the top (which you can't really do) violates, to some degree, the HIG as discussed earlier. 

So, I guess the ideal location is wherever it works best for you. How's that for a safe answer?


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## simX (Feb 23, 2002)

Kenny:  I agree with some of your qualms about the Human Interface Guidelines, but they have only been stretched, not broken.  I have a bunch of things in my Dock so the trash can is always of "least importance".  Also, you can make your Dock extraordinarily small and use magnification if you really need that extra real estate; you can even keep magnification off and you can still know what you're clicking on by the titles.

As for the Dock being at the bottom, it sort of takes place of the launcher as well as the application switcher.  In the launcher's case, it makes sense for it to be at the bottom because it isn't terribly important to have a bunch of aliases to your applications on the screen.  In the respect of application switching, I agree it's a little more tedious, but it works.  That's why I do like to have ASM installed.

Also FruitMenu works perfectly with 1.5.1 (or is it 1.5.2?).  I have my "Apple Menu Items" back, and you can even assign hot keys to the aliases, so right now I can press Command-Option-Shift-D to restart my Dock, because it just simply opens DockRestarter.  Command-Control-I switches/opens iTunes, Command-Control-M does the same for Mail, and Command-Control-O does the same for OmniWeb.  VERY useful.

I have come to love the Dock... especially because of the ability to have changing icons as well as Docklings (DOCKLINGS ROCK!), but I agree it could use some work.  A nice feature would be a tabbed Dock, or a "button" that would reveal a second Dock coming out from behind the first or something.  It would also be nice to have two Docks on the screen at once.  Also, it would be nice to have our own separators --- I would love to be able to have one section for open applications, one for my aliases (which included open applications), one for documents, one for Docklings, one for documents and folders, one for minimized windows, and the last for the Trash.

Oh, by the way... the reason you can't put the Trash on the desktop is because of the confusion that people got in the Classic Mac OS interface: you'd drag a disk or a CD or a server to the Trash.  Now when you do that, because the Dock can have changing icons, the trash changes to an eject icon when you are dragging CDs or servers, and its title changes to "Eject" or "Disconnect".  I like it that way.

Oh, another thing.  You CAN put the Dock under the menu bar.  Use TinkerTool, and you can put it at the top. 


One feature that I think would be really cool is if there was a resize  button or close/minimize/maximize/toolbar widgets obscured by the Dock, that when you move your mouse over them, the Dock would "move out of the way" to allow you to click on it -- it would sort of spread itself so that your action would click on the widget, not the Dock.  But it might be weird if you wanted to access something right above a widget -- I dunno.  I suppose I should stop typing here.


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## hazmat (Feb 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by adambyte _
> *So, based on the Apple human interface guidelines, what would be the ideal position and pinning for the dock? *



Not sure about the guidelines, but I keep it on the right edge of the screen.  What excites me (and also pisses me off at times) is that OS X is NeXT.  I always found NeXT very cool, and now I get to use it on a daily basis.

I think it's interesting that people complain that  things were taking OUT with OS X, but it's the opposite.  The OS 9 like things were put IN.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this seems how it is.


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## hazmat (Feb 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by kenny _
> *
> I had occasion to use a 7.1 machine just yesterday, which is probably what fueled part of my rather lengthy post earlier. It's just so much less cluttered than what we've gotten used to with later versions of the OS.
> *



This is an unfortunate result of "progression" of OS's.  They tend to get more bloated.  Similar issues with MS Windows.  NT -> 2k.  NT would be awesome if it had the 2k core, since I hate how the shell has gotten so bloated.


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## NielZ (Feb 24, 2002)

I like it, but i think it has to be more 'interactive'. It's nice to play a QT movie in it, but useless. Window users can see the speed and how for their DL is (in %), and wich MP3 they are playing. They can close windows from the dock, not only the whole app.
But besides this i like it, quick qay to lauch often-used-apps.


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## GadgetLover (Feb 24, 2002)

> _Originally posted by sfsheath _
> *Unless I'm mistaken, you don't get hierarchical menus for the folders that are in folders placed in the dock so it's not the exact same functionality. *



What are you talking about!?  Yes you do!

Give it a try ... 

[Whining more than the Russian figure skaters]

(Just kidding)


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## smeger (Feb 24, 2002)

I have two major power-user problems with the dock.  When I'm working, I'm fast enough that I'm generally several steps ahead of the computer at all times.  But since the location of items in the dock changes, I can't just let muscle-memory take me to an item and then click - I have to actually look at the icons and find the one I'm looking for.  Slow me down...

The only way to fix this that I've found is to pin the dock at one end and only run programs that I always keep in the dock.  Which brings me to problem two...

The dock needs to be hierarchial.  I keep all of my progams in DragThing, arranged with tabs.  Business apps in one tab, graphics stuff in another, utilities in a third, and so on.  If I put 'em all in the dock, I'd have 30-40 apps sitting there and it would be hard to see the one I wanted.  So, the dock needs to be hierarchial.  

So my "solution" is to use DragThing's launcher and application switcher for everything and Keyboard Maestro to switch apps using key commands.  And I just don't minimize windows - I option-click to hide apps.  

But even so, the dock pisses me off when I accidentally show it by mousing to the bottom of the screen.

Moral of the story is that the dock sucks ass for people who move quickly and use lots of programs.


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## aluminum (Feb 24, 2002)

The dock is wonderful for joe-blow who walks off the street and starts drooling over bouncing, transparent icons.

For anyone that needs to actually get work done, the Dock is a half-baked solutoin.

There are several problems with it:

1) It just one 'group'. That's as old-fashioned as you can get. For it to be useful in terms of organizing your applications, it needs to allow you to create groups that are, ideally, tabbed ala Quicklaunch and Dragthing.

2) At least for me, it's very difficult to see which app is the higlighted app when quickly apple-tabbing through. They actually grey-out the active app, which makes it diffiicult to immediately identify the icon. 4 out of 5 times, I end up landing on the app just before or after the one I actually want to use.

3) Related to the dock is the application switcher. Yes, it's better than OS9's, but it is not as good as Windows' default switcher and a very far cry from the EXCELLENT liteswitch plug-in. The biggest issue is that I need to switch between the same two programs often. With the Dock, I need to tab through 20-some apps to get back to the beginning.

What REALLY bugs me about the Dock is that Apple knew better. Programmers have been making EXCELLENT tools for this (as mentioned, LiteSwitch and QuickLaunch are great) yet they chose to ignore those concepts completely and make a shiny gee-whiz gizmo instead of a productivity enhancer.


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## Krevinek (Feb 24, 2002)

To be honest, I like the Dock, but realize it could be better.

I got used to Gnome 1.4 and Yellow Dog Linux for awhile, and when I installed MacOS X, I did some non-Mac customization that I got used to and liked under Gnome.

First, I killed all the desktop icons. My desktop is now clean as a whistle under X, and this is the way I like it. I get frustrated every time I update OmniWeb to have it download onto the desktop again. Also, I moved the Dock to the right side of the desktop, which in my situation, only eats up the space the desktop icons usually do, and under OS 9, I needed access to.

I never really used the Apple Menu much for that purpose, and under OS 9, I actually use A-Dock for application switching. So for a guy in my position and wants, the Dock is actually pretty darn useful.


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## hazmat (Feb 25, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Krevinek _
> *First, I killed all the desktop icons. My desktop is now clean as a whistle under X, and this is the way I like it. I get frustrated every time I update OmniWeb to have it download onto the desktop again. Also, I moved the Dock to the right side of the desktop, which in my situation, only eats up the space the desktop icons usually do, and under OS 9, I needed access to.
> *



I don't understand about OmniWeb. It downloads to ~/download for me.  I set that in the Prefs.


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## Krevinek (Feb 25, 2002)

Dunno what it is myself, but so far, every time I do an update to OmniWeb, my prefs get reset. Especially with the jump to 4.1b


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## edX (Feb 25, 2002)

> _Originally posted by aluminum _
> 
> 1) It just one 'group'. That's as old-fashioned as you can get. For it to be useful in terms of organizing your applications, it needs to allow you to create groups



this is what dockswitcher and dock swap and all the other multidock haxies give you.  they are cheap and work like they claim



> 2) At least for me, it's very difficult to see which app is the higlighted app when quickly apple-tabbing through. They actually grey-out the active app, which makes it diffiicult to immediately identify the icon. 4 out of 5 times, I end up landing on the app just before or after the one I actually want to use.



once docks are grouped, they can be very large visible icons for easy recognition



> 3) Related to the dock is the application switcher. Yes, it's better than OS9's, but it is not as good as Windows' default switcher and a very far cry from the EXCELLENT liteswitch plug-in. The biggest issue is that I need to switch between the same two programs often. With the Dock, I need to tab through 20-some apps to get back to the beginning.



how is finding the collapsed window of the app you are switching to so hard? as long as you take a fraction of a sec to minimize the old window, then it is right there when you need it.  or get ASM to put the old os 9 style back.

when you bring Windows in and start raving about it, it makes me wonder if what you are really complaining about is that it is not what you are used to. i know i dealt with that for a while when i switched. Now i find working in os 9 to be slow and cumbersome. It just takes time to create new muscle memories and new mental habits.


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## aluminum (Feb 25, 2002)

> this is what dockswitcher and dock swap and all the other multidock haxies give you. they are cheap and work like they claim



Not quite to my liking. I want tabs. I want to be able to drag an icon onto a tab to see that group. Do any of the multi-dock apps allow you to do that, or do you have to manually switch docks before dragging a file onto an app? I'd argue that it is more laborous to switch docks than to just dig through all of the icons on one dock. 



> once docks are grouped, they can be very large visible icons for easy re



This is a bit of a tangent, but it brings up another issue of mine. I'm not sold on the new icons in OSX. They're not really icons any more. They are photos. The whole concept of icons in GUI design is to make them as simple as possible, as it's much easier to register what an icon is at first glance. A photo take a lot more brain processing to interpret.

They're certainly pretty, and I'm sure, over time, I'll get used to them, but I still prefer inconish icons. 



> how is finding the collapsed window of the app you are switching to so hard? as long as you take a fraction of a sec to minimize the old window, then it is right there when you need it.



Fraction of seconds add up over a days work. The application switcher has two problems:

 1) It switches between apps based on the dock order...not the 'last used' order. (I'm usually switching between the last 2-4 apps while working, so why make me tab through all 20 open apps?)

 2) The dock isn't an ideal place to visually display this. It should be dead-center in the screen ala Windows or Liteswitch. I see absolutely no benefit to tying this feature into the dock.



> when you bring Windows in and start raving about it, it makes me wonder if what you are really complaining about is that it is not what you are used to.



Who said I was raving about Windows? Windows has a lot of problems. That said, Windows DOES have some VERY nice user interface elements that apple could have easily borrowed. In fact OS9 had some VERY nice user interface elements that Apple SHOULD have brought into OSX (Window shading, pop-up folders, spring-loaded folders, etc.) These are all great, apple-only innovations that they scrapped just to make a new, prettier OS?



> It just takes time to create new muscle memories and new mental habits.



My point is that OSX has some nice elements. The DOCK is neat for beginnners...but not optimized for power users. Apple is dissappointing me with OSX in that they are not longer the leader in GUI OS design from a usability standpoint. It seems as if they spent more time making shiny buttons and drop shadows than they did in user testing and workflow research.


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## genghiscohen (Feb 25, 2002)

I also would have gone with "I like it, but..."  It does a few things very nicely indeed.  I keep Memory Monitor, CPU Monitor and ThermoInDock running to provide neat little summaries of system info.  I also keep about half a dozen of my most frequently used apps in my Dock.  But I *also* have (and make use of) ASM, Snard the Menu, LaunchBar and FruitMenu.  Between them all, I can get things done pretty damn quickly.


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## hazmat (Feb 25, 2002)

> _Originally posted by aluminum _
> *
> My point is that OSX has some nice elements. The DOCK is neat for beginnners...but not optimized for power users. Apple is dissappointing me with OSX in that they are not longer the leader in GUI OS design from a usability standpoint. It seems as if they spent more time making shiny buttons and drop shadows than they did in user testing and workflow research. *



Actually, I guess I would consider myself a power user.  I find the Dock very useful for certain things.  I use WindowShade X to make the minimize button hide the app.  Right-clicking on the Dock app icon shows all the active windows of that app.  For something like a web browser or Terminal, I find it very useful to use the app icon's context menu for going to whatever window I want.  I find the standard minimizing to cluttered.  All I want from the app I can get form its context menu.  I can also quit the app from there as well in basically one shot.  Right click and hit Quit.  Nice.  And like genghiscohen, I also keep Memory Monitor there, so I have constant updates of memory usage.


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## strobe (Feb 25, 2002)

The Dock does just about everything in the most obtuse wasteful manner.

If I could I would replace it with a global floating list of apps. The reason I can't is the Dock uses a private API which allows it to know which apps need attention and also how to activate specific windows. 

Apple should open the source code to the Dock, but to do that would be to admit that Steve's gizmo doesn't please everybody.

It sucks!


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## divibisan (Mar 18, 2002)

if you like the old app menu and the old apple menu try getting "max menus" it makes 4 little tabs in the corners of the screen which you can set up.


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## Myke (Mar 18, 2002)

It seems to me we should all be grateful that we can customise X to use it the way we want. Not so easy with Windows, I think ...

I'm a Fruitmenu fan - it has never been flakey for me.

The dock is an OK idea, but it needs more thought. It can get very cluttered and I still can't work out the logic behind whether the icons appear on the left or the right side. Can anyone help?

Also it's hard to know whether an app is open or not, since some icons stay in the dock all the time, others only when the app is active.

Form over function I'd say.


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## divibisan (Mar 18, 2002)

Apps appear on the left side of the dock and folders and minimized windows appear on the right. Docklings can be on either side

I don't have any problem seeing if an app's open, the little triangls on the bottom make it easy, at least for me.


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## aluminum (Mar 18, 2002)

> Form over function I'd say.



I think that, overall, is why I'm not as happy with OSX as I had hoped I would have been. 

In many cases, it appears that Apple decided to forgo function in favor of form, or that there were compromises that allowed form to take precedence in too many cases.

The dock is a wonder to play with...the zooming icons, the transparencies, the bouncing alerts, etc...all very cute and fun-to-watch elements, but those should have come AFTER they made the functionality amazing. 

But, as we all know, functionality isn't really what sells a product initially...


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## meancode (Mar 18, 2002)

i have my dock on the lower right, and DragThing on the upper left of my TiBook.  i could do away with the dock except for some specific uses it has, that i have grown very accustom to since using OS X.  i like icon notifications such as when Entourage has new mail, or when an app wants to get your attention it bounces up and down, even if the dock is hidden.  i also use a dockling called MacReporter that i think is great.  there are other docklings built into some software now, like iTunes, SNAX, etc.  so i use the dock and DragThing together.


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## chemistry_geek (Aug 12, 2002)

> _Originally posted by aluminum _
> *The dock is wonderful for joe-blow who walks off the street and starts drooling over bouncing, transparent icons.
> 
> For anyone that needs to actually get work done, the Dock is a half-baked solutoin.
> ...



I disagree that the Dock is a half-baked solution.  I couldn't live without it.  The Dock offers a fair amount of customizability.  After installing LinuxPPC 2000 on my Mac several years ago, I wanted the Gnome Dock/Task Bar in OS 9.  You can place anything you want almost anywhere.  It would be nice if Apple have multiple Docks for the power users as an option.  LinuxPPC 2000 had 2 Docks, it was great.

Four programs I use frequently mesh very well with the Dock: LoadInDock, ThermoInDock, NetStatInDock, and QuickTime Player.  All four have active icons in the Dock.  QuickTime Player is nice for watching/listening to a news stream.  You can just run the cursor over the icon to see if the video is worth expanding to a full-sized window.

If you turn off Dock animations, turn on magnification, tabbing through applications is very easy to see selected or forefront applications.


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## BSDimwit (Aug 12, 2002)

My reply was neutral as I think it lacks some functionality... While I know there are 3rd party apps that make use of virtual desktops, I feel apple should write one.  To me, Aqua is nothing more than a glorified window manager, for those people that are accustomed to a unix like interface, this would add tons to the functionality of the gui as a whole.  In its current incarnation the dock is ok as an app launcher(it gets in the way sometimes) but this lack real estate issue I have would be solved by having multiple destops like KDE, Gnome, Windowmaker and various other windowing managers available in a unix environment.  Yeah know this is a mac, and some might feel that its not very mac like to include them, but I say, hey, if you want them, use them otherwise don't.  I don't buy the old addage that its not very mac like.  If it makes the gui more usable/convenient, then in my opinion, it is.  Yes, I am fairly new to the mac, and mac users of old have gotten so used to key/click combinations that they can be fast and efficient using the gui... but having to hide stuff just to get it out of your way is tedious when you are used other environments.  I wish I could change the focus options too, but thats another post(sloppy focus .


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## fryke (Aug 18, 2002)

me too. virtual desktops and mouse focus options. but then again, that's what free-/shareware is for on this platform. and they do a good job, i think. it's what i said the first day someone came complaining to me about the dock: "wait for the shareware, wait for the shareware." and here it is, isn't it?

ASM by vercruesse.de
TinkerTool
DragThing
DragStrip
LaunchBar (couldn't live without it...)

You'll find all these on versiontracker.com - and more, of course...

Btw.: LaunchBar is _really_ neat and the perfect addition to the Dock for me. I don't want 25 icons in my Dock (launcher icons), only the ones I'm using regularily, and LaunchBar gives me all I want in addition.


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## BSDimwit (Aug 18, 2002)

more on what these shareware apps do.  Lauchbar is pretty self explanatory but I am not familiar with the others.  

I am one of the switchers, but I did it just before the ads started appearing.  I have been a Windows user for quite some time as well as FreeBSD.  I harbor many ill feelings to MS for various reasons(Antitrust, Anti-competittiveness, anti-stabilty, plug and pray...) but the customization ability that is the norm instead of the exception in un*x systems really appealed to me.  Then along comes a mainstream company that has decided to embrace the stability of BSD and make it all its own in a truly groundbreaking way... well I was sold.  I waited a while while most of the bugs were worked out and then I jumped on the bandwagon and bought a tibook 550 off of Ebay.  My windows PC only gets used now as a file server and the occasional Everquest gaming client.  I am this close to dropping it completely but EQ is the only thing that keeps me from it.

Anyway, thanks for the heads up on those other apps.  Long live FreeBSD and Darwin/Mac OSX


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## fryke (Aug 19, 2002)

ASM
... is an Application Switcher Menu (OS 9 style) which also lets you control - to some extent - application focus modes. Needs an update for Jaguar, runs fine in 10.1.5.

TinkerTool
Unlocks some hidden features of Finder/Dock. Will be updated for Jaguar soon, but there's a on-the-fly version for Jaguar available.

DragThing
Is a launcher replacement. Many docks are better than one is their mission statement, I think. 

DragStrip
Same thing, different company.

LaunchBar (couldn't live without it...)
LaunchBar lets you launch apps via keyboard shortcuts. Hit a shortcut and enter part of the name of the app. Really great! (Can't say it enough...)


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## mindbend (Aug 20, 2002)

Maybe this exists, I don't know as I've never looked for it or heard about it...I would like a dockling or something (maybe something on the top of the screen in the open white space) that displays basic info about a file or group of files. I am annoyed by having to open up the get info window all the time for basic file info. I'm not sure why, but I seem to have to get file info a LOT. I would prefer that somewhere on the screen in a fixed spot I could always look for basic file size/number of files selected, etc.

I know I can open a get info box and leave it open, but it's too big. What would be really cool is not even a window, but a "super" as we say in video editing of the info in the bottom right. Kind of like ThermoInDock does with varying transperncies. Any ideas?


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## MacLuv (Nov 26, 2002)




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