# Will Apple get rid of the OS 9 emulator?



## Perseus (Dec 24, 2004)

I have an old PowerMac 6500/275 which I would like to get rid of. I am currently using  OS 10.2.x, which has the OS 9 emulator. I have old programs and documents I still use from this old OS, and had thought about keeping my old PowerMac because I heard somewhere that the new OS will not have the OS 9 emulator.  Is this true? I want to make sure I can still use these old programs if I upgrade to 10.3 and above. Will Tiger have an emulator? Should I keep the PowerMac?


----------



## bobw (Dec 24, 2004)

Not true. It's OS 9.2.2 in OS X, called Classic. You can use older programs using Classic while running OS X. The OS or a new machine may not come with OS 9, I'm not sure, but you can install from an OS 9 CD.


----------



## gumse (Dec 25, 2004)

You probably heard that newer PowerMac's can't boot 9.x , but I think Classic will be supported for a long time into the future.


----------



## AdmiralAK (Dec 26, 2004)

I wish apple (or someone) would produce and actual OS 9 emulator. I have Connectix's virtual playstation (or whatever it is called), with games which I used to play which i can no longer play


----------



## HateEternal (Dec 26, 2004)

AdmiralAK said:
			
		

> I wish apple (or someone) would produce and actual OS 9 emulator. I have Connectix's virtual playstation (or whatever it is called), with games which I used to play which i can no longer play



Yes! I want to get in some tie figher and X-wing!


----------



## symphonix (Dec 26, 2004)

I'm pretty sure that the OS9 support in Mac OS X will continue to exist in more-or-less exactly the form it is now. Current Macs ship with the OS9/Classic environment on the Extras CD, which is pretty convenient. I'd say it will continue to stay on the Extras CD for at least the next couple of years.


----------



## adambyte (Dec 27, 2004)

And, I hate to be a nitpicky bastard, but I just can't let this go by... it's not an emulator. When you run OS 9 "Classic" under OS X, what you're basically doing is running one OS inside the other.... essentially running two OSes natively, at the same time.

Emulation is when you use software top "emulate" another chipset, such as running windows on an Intel machine.

whew. Done being nitpicky


----------



## Natobasso (Dec 29, 2004)

It's my understanding that Apple won't be bundling "Classic" with OS X after Panther, but if you have it it will still work, as bobw suggested.


----------



## Natobasso (Dec 29, 2004)

Here's a good article on Classic/OS X:

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2002/sep/10macosx.html


----------



## bobw (Dec 29, 2004)

Emulation - hardware or software that permits programs written for one computer to be run on another usually newer computer.


----------



## chevy (Dec 29, 2004)

Like runing 68000 code on a PowerPC.


----------



## Krevinek (Jan 2, 2005)

chevy said:
			
		

> Like runing 68000 code on a PowerPC.


 But it isn't like running 68000 code on a PowerPC. (Which is emulation)

In this case, it is closer to running OS 9 within a sandbox. The newest hardware /can/ run it, but it just can't boot it (because the knowledge of the OF and hardware isn't in OS 9 for it to boot properly).

The thing is, I don't see Apple getting rid of this anytime soon without some sort of announcement, as people do rely on it, and the sandbox app (Classic) does not actually take much space on an installation. It just doesn't make sense to remove it without letting people know about the choice, in my mind.


----------



## DeltaMac (Jan 2, 2005)

Keep in mind that OS X has not included any OS 9 since vers 10.2 (Jaguar) was released almost 2 1/2 years ago. Since that time a completely clean install just SUPPORTS the Classic environment, which will not operate without at least some of the OS 9 installed. As has been mentioned, OS 9 on new systems is not installed, and Classic will not operate until it is installed manually. I don't expect this to change with Tiger.


----------



## Krevinek (Jan 2, 2005)

This is very true, and I expect it to remain this way for a long time. Those who already have OS 9 might keep using it for awhile to come, but those who don't already have it, aren't likely to want/need a copy. I have an old copy of PageMaker, and I have nearly zero reason to upgrade for my purposes (I did get it at a garage sale). However, someone just coming over to the Mac now is likely to get a MacOS X compatible copy of InDesign or Quark rather than something like PageMaker 5.


----------



## Darkshadow (Jan 3, 2005)

For y'all that were wishing for something that will show OS 9 in its own window, Mac-on-Linux is working on it.  For anyone not familiar with it, it's a sort-of emulator that runs in Linux and will allow one to run OS 9/OS X/Linux.  I say it's a sort-of emulator because it doesn't really emulate the PPC - it's more of a sandbox like Classic, but it runs the whole environment in its own window.

I've got it up and running, so here's a screen shot y'all can look at.  It's a 1600x1200 screen shot; just warning y'all (about 300K).

I wouldn't get all fired up about it yet though - this is from a developer snapshot of the code.  It doesn't have sound, and doesn't have internet.  It only supports one mouse button, even if you do have a multi-button mouse.  It doesn't see installed hardware.  It requires X11, as it uses it to display the actual window.  Getting it to boot from a drive is somewhat of a pain, and you have to manually add drives to a config file before running it.  I also had to patch a few things before it would work (and locked my system up at least 10 times in the process).  *But* it _is_ up and running.  Sooner or later, some of those issues will get fixed.  It's actually kinda cool just to play around in OS 9 like I used to.

I think, right now, it will only run OS 9, but once the code is finalized, it should be able to run Linux or OS X in it as well.  A different version of OS X than your boot drive, of course, as that's not allowed (drive has to be unmounted for mol to be able to use it).  Which could have a cool benefit of easily testing stuff out without messing up your main OS install. 

If anyone's really that interested, I can give details about what needs to be patched (not much, really) so it'll run correctly.


----------



## acidtuch10 (Jan 5, 2005)

Darkshadow - Could you point me to the information needed to run "mac on Linux" with in OS X or what you had to do to get it running?


Thanks


----------



## Cat (Jan 5, 2005)

http://www.maconlinux.org/

Works like a charm.


----------



## Darkshadow (Jan 5, 2005)

Some patching of sources and set up needed on OS X, though.

I sent an email to you, acidtuch.  The stuff is a bit long winded, so I decided not to post it here.  If anyone else wants the instructions, let me know.


----------



## lordofrealbasic (Jan 7, 2005)

If Apple Drops Classic Support they be i a big troublesome era Mac OS X is barely compatable with stuff right now and classic has way more stuff usable with then OSX 
but classic needs to be more integrated like perhaps an actual switchable environment.
+ Anyone Live in canada that wan'ts to get rid of an older powerbook for any of my products on my Classified page  http://www.macosx.com/forums/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=48577


----------



## Arden (Jan 8, 2005)

Two years ago, that post would have been accurate.  Now, it's pretty much the other way around.  Sure, there are lots of people who still use OS 9 on a full-time basis, but the VAST majority of software and support is for OS X nowadays.

If by a switchable environment, you mean something like being able to boot into OS 9, well, that was taken out a couple years ago.  And Classic is pretty well-integrated as it is, since you can switch from OS X to OS 9 applications easily, their icons appear in the Dock, etc.

I give Classic an estimated 5 years to live, if not less.  5 years from now, I don't think Apple will be building Classic support into their OS at all.


----------



## bobw (Jan 8, 2005)

> Mac OS X is barely compatable with stuff right now



Couldn't be further from the truth.


----------



## trexplorer (Jan 24, 2005)

Darkshadow said:
			
		

> Some patching of sources and set up needed on OS X, though.
> 
> I sent an email to you, acidtuch.  The stuff is a bit long winded, so I decided not to post it here.  If anyone else wants the instructions, let me know.




Hi - Can u send me instructions on how to install MOL on OS X ... Are there any special packages required, etc.. and any required patches ...

Thanks.


----------



## brianleahy (Jan 24, 2005)

I would bet that the day will eventually come when classic support goes away, but not for a while yet.

I would surmise that it will probably accompany a hardware release -- that is, some new processor (the G8 or G9 maybe) will lack the ability to run classic.


----------



## albloom (Jan 25, 2005)

Actually, you can't install classic from an OS9 CD on a new
machine, Bob. You have to be able to boot into OS9 to install
OS9. And OSX doesn't come with OS9. You need to install Classic
from the "restore" disc(s) that came with the machine.


----------

