# Firefox



## powermac (Dec 15, 2005)

I can't seem to warm up to firefox browser. I like the idea of themes, and play around with those. Generally the look and feel of firefox does not capture me. I use for a short time, and always go back to Safari.
In my opinion next to Safari it is the best browser. It is fast and renders nice. The download window is cumbersome compared to Safari, that is my biggest complaint. How do others feel about firefox?


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## fryke (Dec 15, 2005)

I personally don't get warm with it either. That's mainly because it just doesn't feel like an OS X application, and I guess that'll never really change. I guess even if it were 3x faster than Safari, I couldn't really live with it as my default browser. I keep it around, though, a) for testing websites against it and b) to look at pages that are rendered incorrectly (or not at all) in Safari/OmniWeb.


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## kainjow (Dec 15, 2005)

I agree. I used it for a while, but once Safari 1.3 came out, I switched back. Firefox is slightly faster, but I'd rather have the OS X look and feel, and spelling, then a few milliseconds of my time.


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## powermac (Dec 15, 2005)

Great point Kainjow. Fryke hit it on the head for me, it just doesn't have the OSX feeling, and perhaps that is why I can't warm up to it. Too bad they could not make Firefox a true OSX app, in that case it would rock. Now all we need is to get Apple to write an office app, or update Apple Work, I would be in heaven.::love::


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## boyfarrell (Dec 15, 2005)

Does anybody else notice the difference in page rendering between Safari and FireFox? Safari seem to have more contrast. For example, you can't see the bottom of the search field box at google; it just blends into the rest of the white page. 

Additionally, the buttons are not aqua.


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## HateEternal (Dec 15, 2005)

Yea its just not the same on the Mac. I use it all the time on my PC but harldy ever on my Mac.

The plugins are awesome, being able to modify the css of the page you are on is so sweet.


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## Satcomer (Dec 15, 2005)

I feel the same way on a Mac so I went with the more Apple like Cocoa written browsers Camino. I then always get the latest Camino browser nightly build (it is the Mozilla open source Mac centric browser) with CaminoKnight. You can also skin Camino with Camincon. Also if you go to VersionTracker and/or MacUpdate and do a search on Camino you can personalize Camino with you own language plus so much more. This happens because Camino is written in the native OS X language Cocoa.


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## boyfarrell (Dec 15, 2005)

Is there away to override camino's builtin shortcuts? I find it impossible to hold alt+cmd+right with on hand on my powerbook?


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## Mikuro (Dec 15, 2005)

boyfarrell said:
			
		

> Is there away to override camino's builtin shortcuts? I find it impossible to hold alt+cmd+right with on hand on my powerbook?


Yes, you can do this using OS X's built-in method for customizing keyboard shortcuts. Go to System Preferences > Keyboard & Mouse > Keyboard Shortcuts, scroll to the bottom of the list, and add a new entry. Set the application to Camino, the menu title to "Next Tab", and the shortcut to whatever you want.

This technique works with virtually all applications.


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## mdnky (Dec 16, 2005)

Firefox is still utilizing QuickDraw for it's display, which is the main factor in it being "un-OS X" feeling.  According to the roadmap at the Mozilla Wiki, Firefox won't go to Quartz until version 3.0 is released (Q1 2007).


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## kainjow (Dec 16, 2005)

mdnky said:
			
		

> Firefox is still utilizing QuickDraw for it's display, which is the main factor in it being "un-OS X" feeling.  According to the roadmap at the Mozilla Wiki, Firefox won't go to Quartz until version 3.0 is released (Q1 2007).


From their website:


> Firefox will use cocoa widgets and become a Cocoa-based application


By then, Safari will have so many features, speed and stability, Firefox being a Cocoa app will be quite late in the browser market, but if it's popularity keeps up, it may be a huge move for them.


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## boyfarrell (Dec 16, 2005)

Isn't QuickDraw very dated these days, I remember it back in System 8.5! So FireFox for mac is a Carbon app?

Also, with camino being Cocoa what's the point for firefox to be rewritten?

Dan


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## Mikuro (Dec 16, 2005)

Yes, QuickDraw comes from Classic. It's been around since....well, since System 1.0, I guess.

Firefox uses Quartz-style text smoothing, though (thank goodness!), so as far as I'm concerned it doesn't make much of a difference as far as usability goes. It's not like you can't use standard interface elements with Carbon; they just don't.

Camino is Cocoa-based, but it doesn't have a lot of features, and it doesn't have an extension system like Firefox. I suppose it would be just as easy to create add-ons for Camino as it is for Safari, but for some reason there are none.


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## symphonix (Dec 19, 2005)

I use firefox at work on my PC all the time. The plugins (Adblock, EXIF viewer, Google Suggest, Google & Yahoo ad-blocker, etc) are very helpful, and the quick-searches are very useful.

That said, I stil use Safari on my Mac, even though I have Firefox setup exactly the same. Safari is somehow more enjoyable to use - more milk for less moo, as it were.


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## baldprof (Jan 4, 2006)

Hmm. Maybe this is the place to mention this, maybe not.

Firefox generally works well at this site unless you are a volunteer tech and try to check the Open Questions. Then it get's caught in a page refresh loop. At least that's what it does for me.

I am going back to Safari as the default browser.


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## ecirtap (Jan 4, 2006)

Yes, Firefox definitely lacks that OS X feel, but: 

There are all those fantastic Extensions - wow! Many I would not be able to live without. 

Long-time fave: Session Saver. 

patrice
patriceschneider.com/apple-osx/blog/


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## powermac (Jan 5, 2006)

The best thing is, that we all can have this discussion. Meaning, the variety of web browsers available for the Mac. The one browser I miss is Netscape stand alone browser for OS8-9. That was a great browser, slimmed down, and ran great. In all these discussions, no one ever mentions Netscape. I don't even have it installed on my computer anymore.


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## fryke (Jan 5, 2006)

Well... If *I* remember correctly, Netscape was never "slim" after version 2.x... It became one bloated beast in fact, which the open source guys noticed, too, once Netscape released the mozilla source code. Nowadays, "Netscape", as a product, is basically dead, since it's merely a repackaged mozilla/Firefox which is never up-to-date with the open source development. Hence people are using Firefox instead.


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## nixgeek (Jan 5, 2006)

The only thing that bothers me about the mozilla team is that even though they are open source, no one is making the effort to port the latest version to OS 9.  Is it that difficult a task to do so?  After all, it IS open source and anyone can take the source code and modify it to work with OS 9.


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## Viro (Jan 6, 2006)

The question is whether there is a demand for apps on OS 9. After all, that OS has been officially dead for how many years now?


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## Mikuro (Jan 6, 2006)

Netscape was a beast. And I mean that in a bad way. It was huge, and ate up tons of RAM. Netscape 2 was nice. 3 was reasonably lean. 4 was bloated. And after that it was just a sad shadow of what it once was, in terms of speed, features, usability, and just about everything else. It was just Mozilla's uglier, dumber brother.

I miss *iCab*. I know iCab is still around, but....well, I miss when it was fast and modern. When it first came out, it smacked everything else around soooo hard. And it was small, too. It's still my browser of choice for OS 9 (and 7 and 8, for that matter!), with a third-party build of Mozilla (not up to date, but closer than the official one, at least) as my backup.


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## nixgeek (Jan 6, 2006)

iCab 3.0 is available now for PPC systems running Classic Mac OS. I tested it out and it's pretty good, especially when rendering sites. However, even though the demand isn't that high, not that many people have a desperate need to upgrade to OS X. Some people are just fine with OS and below. For this reason I don't understand why someone hasn't taken up the task to port FF, or even the Mozilla Suite (which is going to live on as SeaMonkey) at the very least. It doesn't have to have EVERY little fix that comes out, but at least to update it so that security-wise it's up to snuff.


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