# How come nobody mentioned this? ColdFusion on OSX?



## Gedankenspiel (Jan 22, 2003)

I usually visiti macromedia.com all the time but for the first time in a while I haven't and can you believe it - they release ColdFusion MX for OSX!!!!!

This is AMAZING news and I can't believe I haven't read the news in any forum on Macosx.com (which I check more frequently than macromedia.com).

The fact that Macromedia has released its Java based application server JRUN for MAC OSX opens a huge door to the Mac world. Finally Webobjects and PHP are not the only two application servers that can run on the Mac.

For me personally it means NO MORE WINDOWS! The only reason why I had an old Dell server around was so I could run ColdFusion on it and develop it on the Mac. 

Anyone care to join the party? Whohooo!

G


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## stealth (Jan 22, 2003)

excuse me . dumb person here!!! (thats me)
whats Cold Fusion?


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## designer (Jan 22, 2003)

Yes it has been posted here before but it's gone somehow...


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## uoba (Jan 22, 2003)

Well, I for one think this great news, and thnx for bringing it my attention  Gedankenspiel! Can't believe I haven't noticed this!


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## Trip (Jan 22, 2003)

Woohoo!
Even though i havn't touched ColdFusion more than once i still think this is great news!


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## wiz (Jan 22, 2003)

yahooo!!! macromedia now completely supports the mac with all its major products

web productivity enhanced


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## slo (Jan 22, 2003)

Can you clarify for me what the difference between CF and CF J2EE server is? It seems that CF is not available for the Mac, but CF J2EE is. I'm confused if there is a difference.

Also, although I know of CF, I don't know too much about it. Is it a newer version of Generator, or does it have broader applications?

Thanks for any info!


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## JetwingX (Jan 22, 2003)

thats cool and all but i need three things
1) the server
2) the money to buy the server
3) the moey to but CF
it really isn't that cheep (over 1k ?)


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## dani++ (Jan 23, 2003)

> _Originally posted by slo _
> *Can you clarify for me what the difference between CF and CF J2EE server is? It seems that CF is not available for the Mac, but CF J2EE is. I'm confused if there is a difference.
> 
> Also, although I know of CF, I don't know too much about it. Is it a newer version of Generator, or does it have broader applications?
> ...



I think that ColdFusion standalone lets you run CF apps. ColdFusion J2EE lets you run CF apps on top of Java J2EE servers (like JRUN).

dani++


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## AdmiralAK (Jan 23, 2003)

ColdFusion is a way of making websites, dynamic websites I think.
I wanted to learn CF but I needed a PC... now that there is a mac version I can get my department to buy me a copy and put it on my work G4  lol


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## AppMan (Jan 23, 2003)

I am not sure but I don't think the CF application server will run on OS X.


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## goynang (Jan 24, 2003)

Don't forget good old JSP and Tomcat!

JSP and custom tags are pretty similar to Cold Fusion as far as I'm aware (indeed isn't CF available now a JSP taglib kinda thing - the J2EE version???)

And best of all JSP/Tomcat is free.

I have it setup with a postgres db on my ibook and it runs sweetly.


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## Gedankenspiel (Jan 24, 2003)

To sum it all up: ColdFusion is an application server that allows you to deploy dynamic and database driven websites. It like .ASP from Microsoft except much easier.

JRUN is a Java based application server which does pretty much the same. The only difference is that you use J@EE Java and Java Beans to write your code.  With Macromedia porting J2EE to the Mac it means that you can now run ColdFusion on ALL platforms that support Java and JRUN.

As to the price, JET, you can actuall download the FREE developer version of JRUN, install the FREE developer version of ColdFusion, and use it with a FREE mySQL database on your Mac. When you are ready to deploy an application simply use hosting services that start at $20 per month (I host my sites with hostmysite.com for $27.95 per month).

This is big news for 2 reasons:
1. Mac users have access to another, very powerful application server. They no longer have to buy a PC and run a verison of CF on Windows.

2. Macromedia is heavily supporting the Apple platform for this and is opening the doors to asp's using Apple hardware.

Anyone care to light a celebration candle with me? 
Yippiiie

G
(4th day of extacy over CF)


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## TommyWillB (Feb 2, 2003)

If this IS true, I probably will drop PHP in an instant, but this page clearly says that the OS X Versions is "For development purposes only!"

Is there a press release or some other announcement that I missed?


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## TommyWillB (Feb 2, 2003)

> _Originally posted by AdmiralAK _
> *ColdFusion is a way of making websites, dynamic websites I think.
> I wanted to learn CF but I needed a PC... now that there is a mac version I can get my department to buy me a copy and put it on my work G4  lol *


 As far as I can tell you can not "buy" and OS X version of ColdFusion...

There seems to be a J2EE one that you can use for "development"...


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## twister (Feb 2, 2003)

yea i don't think CF is coming to Mac.  Just all this other stuff which i don't understand what is.

Twister


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## kenny (Feb 2, 2003)

Unless I'm very mistaken, all you need to do is get CFMX for JRun and Jrun for MacOSX, and you'd have a production setup (as opposed to the developer download mentioned earlier). 

The catch is the price. The price for a single-cpu setup is US$4298. For that kind of money, you can build a really nice PHP/Apache server (on whatever your platform of choice is).


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## TommyWillB (Feb 2, 2003)

> _Originally posted by kenny _
> *The catch is the price. The price for a single-cpu setup is US$4298. For that kind of money, you can build a really nice PHP/Apache server (on whatever your platform of choice is). *


 I currently have 8 Solaris boxes at work running the $5000 version of ColdFusion.

I would not want to pay that much for my Mac at home, but the Linux one cost the same as Solaris. WinDoze has two versions, one of which is less.

Once you use ColdFusion you soon learn that it is EASILY worth $5k/server... Most of its competetors charge per CPU, so in comparison this is cheap.


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## kenny (Feb 2, 2003)

We're doing the same thing where I work, so I understand the advantages of CF. We're deploying CFMX on WebSphere 5 (to which we already have licences), and we've got a number of discount schemes in place, so it doesn't cost us quite $5K/cpu. 

I guess my point was that for an individual doing app development, the price is a bit steep for the non-development version. But, I guess that's the way it is for most commercial server software.


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## Gedankenspiel (Feb 4, 2003)

Yes, JRUN is the application server and you buy ColdFusion FOR JRUN. That's how licensing works. And it's true, the price is a bit steep but I look at it from a developer's perspective: I have a Tibook and can now do the development AND design work on the Mac. Try to develop Flash Remoting on a Mac - before it was impossible.

To be fair about pricing, Macromedia does not charge by the CPU but the enterprise version which comes with clustering DOES require additional licenses.

But the money I have saved by deploying quick CFMX apps vs. ASP or PHP would warrant a price tag three times as what it is now. Again, totally psyched here....

G


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## kenny (Feb 6, 2003)

No. Macromedia absolutely _does_ charge per-CPU... I missed that comment in TommyWillB's post ("Most of its competetors charge per CPU, so in comparison this is cheap."), or I'd have commented on this earlier. A little research on MM's site reveals:

JRun 4:
1 cpu - $899
2 cpu - $1799
4 cpu - $3599

CF MX:
1 cpu - $3399
2 cpu - $6798  (!)
(no 4+ cpu offering seemed to be on the website).

Now, it may be that the CF license is not enforced in software. In the 4.x days, all you needed was a valid key - and it was possible to reuse the key across machines, there was no cpu-count-check, etc.. I don't have a clue what it is today with CFMX, but if it's like other commercial server SW, it probably doesn't do a whole lot of checking.

So, yeah, you probably could drop a single-license version on a dualie and have it work, but that's not the same thing as not charging for it...


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## TommyWillB (Feb 6, 2003)

We're running CF 4.5 Enterprise on Solaris and have never been told it is a per/cpu deal.

Possibly wer were misinfrmed, or maybe it changed since then...


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## larry98765 (Aug 18, 2003)

I got CF running on JRUN4 on my mac yesterday. Woo hoo!


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## twister (Aug 18, 2003)

I just use Dreamweaver and it works great


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## octane (Sep 13, 2003)

Funny, loads of people seem happy that Cold Fusion has landed on OS X .. ,most of them not quite sure what it does!

LOL!

Anyway. Yes, Cold Fusion is a development platform Macromedia acquired from Allaire some time ago .. no, Macromedia _ acquired_ Allaire some time ago.


It's a very easy-to-use / easy-to-learn system that, as our American friends would describe as a Soup to Nuts solution.

It's also quite bloated and slow. Unlike php, which is compiled into or part of something else, such as Apache, Cold Fusion is a big old application that site atop the host operating system and devours huge resources.

It's fast [to develop with], it's fun [well,  sort of...] and it's RAD [Rapid Application Development] but it's also _very_ expensive [when you're thinking of developing a web site for unlimited access]

You'll know when you arrive at a Cold Fusion driven web site, all the file names will end will a .cfm

Hope that helps...


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## uoba (Sep 13, 2003)

Yeh, I noticed the demo download when downloading the DWMX 2004 demo... was thinking to give it a go. We tried getting into it when Allaire ran it (3 years)... but we're using PHP now.


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## TommyWillB (Oct 18, 2003)

> _Originally posted by octane _
> *Funny, loads of people seem happy that Cold Fusion has landed on OS X .. ,most of them not quite sure what it does!
> ...
> It's also quite bloated and slow
> ...


I don't totally disagree, but the fact is if you work with a ColdFusion site, you are at a general disadvantage trying to do development on your Mac (vs. your Peecee coworkers). So most of the excitment is that I don't need to rely on my PC so much.

Secondly, it sure would be great to MOVE that friggn ColdFusion site off of WinDoze and onto my Mac... The developer version does not let me do that because it is single-user only.

As far as bloat goes, I have to say it has a TON of features that ASP lacks (unless you buy Windows COM/DLL or Unix .so extensions... which makes IIS less 'free" than it seems.). PHP is great because it, like ColdFusion, is feature-loaded, but I have to say the ColdFusion ones are a lot easier to learn/use. I'll don't mind the CF bloat because I think the features are great! (And comparing my previous W2k CF setup to our work Solaris-CF setup, I have to say Solaris doesn't even blink. CF runs faster on solaris than JBOSS...)

Regarding the CF App server... You comments are right when discussing pre-MX versions. Those were combined App servers that leveraged a lot of OS specific stuff. On MX this instead sits on top of a J2EE... which is where JRUN comes in.

Since this thread started (Feb 2002) I've converted all of my personal site from ISP-hosted W2k ColdFusion to home-hosted OS X PHP. (We're still using Solaris CF at work) PHP is cool, but functionally my site ended up quite different than what it was under CF because I did things the easiest ways I could figure out. I am anxiously awaiting the added (image handling) functionality of PHP 4.3 which, I hope, will come with Panther.


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## scoobysnax (Jul 3, 2004)

i ran across this old post and figured I would update (just in case anyone is still watching it).  BlueDragon is a FREE cfml alternative for Mac OSX and the final version has just been released.  Im using it on 3 sites and it is AWESOME!!

http://www.newatlanta.com/products/bluedragon


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## twister (Jul 6, 2004)

What does it do exactly.  Please explain.


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## scoobysnax (Jul 6, 2004)

basically, it is a free alternative to Macromedia's ColdFusion MX 6.1 application server.  there is a pay version as well, and the tag compatibility is very good.


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## TommyWillB (Jul 9, 2004)

scoobysnax, thanks for posting this very interesting update to the thread that won't die!


> _From newatlanta.com:_
> 
> What's the Catch?
> 
> ...


I know this is a Mac thread, but it I noticed that only the J2EE $2,499/CPU version is the only one that runs on Solaris.


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## scoobysnax (Jul 10, 2004)

where did you get that list of unsupported tags?  its very outdated.  here is current: CFAPPLET,CFGRID,CFGRIDCOLUMN,CFGRIDROW,CFGRIDUPDATE,CFREPORT,CFAUTHENTICATE,CFIMPERSONATE

all stuff i very rarely use- i never use CFGRID, nor do I ever use cfreport.  I've also written a CFX Java custom tag to replace CFMAIL and it works great on the free version.

let's not also forget the NEW tags introduced in BlueDragon like:

CFASSERT,CFBASE,CFCONSTRUCTOR,CFDEBUGGER,CFFORWARD,CFIMAGE!,CFIMAP,CFPAUSE


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## TommyWillB (Jul 11, 2004)

I included the link above, but here it is again: 
http://www.newatlanta.com/products/bluedragon/editorials.cfm

Looking at it now, I see its dated October 2003... That does not seem awefully old, but if it is why do they still have it posted?


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## scoobysnax (Jul 11, 2004)

the 6.1 final release is very new, still only a few weeks old.  That document probably refers to version 3, i think they even have the version 3 downloads on their website still.


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## TommyWillB (Jul 11, 2004)

I understand your point... but it is on a page with a very large pominent link to 6.1 at the top. 

So obviously they took the time to update the page to add that link...


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