# When will Apple get any respect?



## Go3iverson (Jul 10, 2003)

Really, when will it happen?

The questions are always there.  The answers seem to change depending on what Apple comes up with.

Innovation.  Apple has innovated the entire PC market.  Market share?  What can less than 5% do to over 95%?  A lot, evidently.  The Cube?  How many case manufacturers now make cube cases now?  FireWire, USB keyboards/mice, huge LCD displays, DVD burners...it goes on and on.  Heck, look at the Sony Vaio RS320 desktop...Quicksilver anyone?

Motorola drops the ball on the CPUs and we hear about it every day since.  The G4 is this and that and the other thing.  Fine.  Bring in the PPC 970/G5 from IBM.  A beast.  Think about it.  Not too many people go the 167MHz bus G4 chips.  Most of those PowerMacs were at 133Mhz on the bus.  That's one line.  More likely, people had 100Mhz bused computers, or even iBooks that had 66MHz buses for the majority of their existence.  So, we'll say 100Mhz....fast forward to 1000Mhz in a one day turn around.  Couple that with a 64-bit chip, PCI-X, DDR, AGP 8x, 802.11g, etc and you have an amazing turn around and some seriously powerful hardware.

Apple lied.  No, its not that fast.  Oh, it is?  Well, the video card is horrible!  Where are the video games?  Where's the software?

I'm sorry, but my computers are not for games.  I own a few and I own a PC that I built, that never gets turned on.  It's powerful and it has XP Pro on it.  It collects dust.  Nothing wrong with it at all, I just prefer my Macs.  Games don't touch my machines.  That's why I own gaming consoles.  I spend all day at a computer, why would I want to spend what little leisure time I get in front of it too playing games?  I want out of that environment when I can!

And since we're talking about serious computing, why is it that the first knock at Apple is game support?  

This post is not to knock PCs or anything of that nature.  If you got that idea, I'm sorry, it wasn't intended.  Each machine has its strengths and weaknesses.  Just what exactly does Apple have to pull out to get respect?

OS 9 is too unstable?  Ok.  Here's UNIX with the slickest GUI around and an insane level of ease to use.  

It's too carooney and childish...not serious enough.

Windows XP?  Purple and green reminds me of the Joker and it's got more colors in it that OS X.  Now I hear that Longhorn has application animations?  They also have this great new technology where the AGP card takes control of the GUI and desktop and such...wish Mac had that...(Quartz Extreme).

We got that back in 2002.  So when Longhorn comes out in 2005 or early 2006, they'll have 4 year old Mac OS X components in it.

Again, I'm sure Longhorn will be a quality Microsoft product, but why is it that when Apple does it, it's garbage, but when the PC world follows 6 months to 4 years later, it's revolutionary?

Ok, that's enough for now.


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## dave17lax (Jul 11, 2003)

Preaching to the choir, bud.


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## Lycander (Jul 11, 2003)

What makes you think Apple doesn't get the respect they deserve? They release G5 PowerMacs and people accuse them of faking the scores and you feel that's disrespect? I see a lot more respectable websites praising Apple.

Quick word about innovation: some of those "innovations" aren't really innovations, rather it's just Apple taking an existing technology and bringing it to the masses, which is just as good. Other times it's an innovation that doesn't go far. Example: the G4 Cube died young but the concept picked up popularity in the PC market much better.

I agree that games should not be pointed out as a weakness of the Mac platform. But look at it this way, in terms of software available there's nothing you can do on a PC that can't also be done on the Mac and vice versa, they're pretty much equals. Except for games. It's a weakness one way or another but its importance will vary from different people's opinions like yourself.

Apple does have people's respect. What they don't have is more market share, or a smaller user base, call it what you will. It's difficult to explain why it's that way, just as difficult to explain the fanacticism exhibited from some Mac users.

What is it that's really bothering you? You say that you do not care about games on a computer, ok we're past that. There's plenty of software and peripheral hardware to do everything you could want to do with your Mac so nothing lacking there. What is it that's missing for you then?


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## tyma (Jul 11, 2003)

As I've said in a few earlier posts, I'm a recent convert from the Wintel world.  Coming from that side of the virtual globe, I can tell you that many people watch Apple to see what MS is going to have in a few years.  So it's not that Apple is getting dissed, it's more that Microsoft is a BLOATEDLY MONSTEROUSLY FANTASMAGORICALLY HUGE company, and their announcments get afforded top billing.  Apple announcments, on the other hand, generally only reach those already in the Apple community or those specifically watching Apple.

*shrug*

Tim.


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## Arden (Jul 11, 2003)

It certainly is annoying when Apple releases a new line of whatever with all these improvements over anything else out there, yet PC laurels don't even acknowledge that Apple or this product they just released exist when they review something similar, even if inferior.


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## Randman (Jul 11, 2003)

I respect Apple for what its done (even its missteps) and for what it's doing. I think the differences between the two platforms are getting smaller each and every day, but that's not a bad thing. And I know that there others who feel the same way, even if it's not every Tom, Dick and Harry on the block. Then again, most Tom, Dick and Harry aren't too bright and should stick with AOL. I really don't care if the masses get it or not as long as I do, and that it continues so I can still get "it".


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## AnimuS (Jul 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Go3iverson _
> *Really, when will it happen?
> 
> The questions are always there.  The answers seem to change depending on what Apple comes up with.
> ...



i think your giving apple too much credit on the "Apple has innovated the entire PC market"... only a handful of pc manufactures make cube case. USB was created by intel and others i believe to compete with fw. dont know much about lcd's. dvd burners? i dont think apple builds them... 

Most people who bash pc's and macs dont even know what they are talking about most of the time.
Its usually those who are fair minded who know. I must admit im completelty a pc user right now. check my sig for the specs. during the whole G5 benchmark tests there were alot of pc-users on pc majority forums who defended the mac. its really only a handful who need to bash either platform. for what i dont really know.
also i think the argument people make that pcs are only good for games is about as old as macs have no software...

Onto WindowsXP. Ya its not the best OS it has a crap load of security holes that MS does patch its still no excuse considering their massive R&D. I can get through XP fine it does everything i need done. is it sometimes more work then usual of course but what can you do? 

For a time many people bashed mac hardware because their was a  gap with the G3 and G4 compared to intel and amd. so we had faster procs with a mid-level OS. while you guys had a very superior OS and really ahead of its time. now though the gap is next to none. So now you have both hardware and software. If MS can get things right with Longhorn hopefully pc users will also be on the same level with OS and hardware. What does piss me off is microsoft has the capability to make a great OS but with a  market share of 90%+ they could careless. which sux for us...

Lastly you might be thinking what im doing here. Well im mystified by apples innovation. OSX, iapps, the new G5. I also really love the ibook style its awesome...


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## MaC hAcKeR (Jul 11, 2003)

I try to tell people...
Virtual PC! Run Windows on the Mac, run your games and software that dosn't run on Mac!
"PCs are much faster, Macs suck. THe OS sucks. There's no such thing as windows on a mac. Macs crash everytime you start them up"
Get it every time from PC friends...
God... I have to tell theb bout Unix, OS X, VPC, sheesh...
"They cost too much!"
THis is where I walk away... this is the ONLY thing I hate about apple.


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## powermac (Jul 11, 2003)

I see a recent trend of Mac respect. Having used them for 18 years, things are getting better.  I realized it when Cnet gave a Powermac a great review. Not that I care what Cnet says, although for years they trashed Apple for its hardware and software. 
Another trend I see is some, not many win$ users are tried of the interface, worried about the security, and pissed off about the endless updates. 
The Washington Post, NYT, and others have given Apple decent reviews, and praise, traditionally, they did not. 
It is getting somewhat better. Mac OSX has helped.


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## Fahrvergnuugen (Jul 11, 2003)

I love it when people tell me that macs cost too much. The first thing I say is, "well, Porsche's cost a lot too... I guess you want a hyundai."

The slow comment has always made me laugh too... Yes the G4 fell behind the P4 in terms of raw speed...but for anyone whos ever used a top end G4 - honestly, has you ever sat there and said to yourself "God I hate this thing, its so slow"

Computers are so fast these days, the differences between fast and faster don't translate into any difference in user experience.

And then we get into that end of it... I feel _trapped_ when I am using a PC [like right now]. No iTunes, iPhoto, Safari, Adium, Mail.app - the list goes on and on... I'm talking about the dozens of free OSX only aps that I use every day. Sure all of these applications have counter PC competitors _but have you ever used any of them_? They're _horrible_ in comparison!

If price and speed were the only things that mattered, apple wouldn't have any customers. The reality is, user experience is what matters to us, and thats why we use the mac. So what if our market share is less, we're still getting the best experience in the world... Just like driving a Porsche. We're _elite_


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## MisterMe (Jul 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by AnimuS _
> *.... USB was created by intel and others i believe to compete with fw.... *


Intel _bought_ USB. I suppose that purchases pass for creations in the Wintel world.


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## Pengu (Jul 11, 2003)

Bought USB?
unless this is something new, it seems to me, that Intel, Apple, Microsoft, IBM, HP etc were all members of an alliance that created USB. USB1 never was, and never could have been a competitor to Firewire.


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## Go3iverson (Jul 11, 2003)

Again, I'm not saying Apple invented USB or the DVD burner, I'm saying they set the trend on those things that we all as a computing community reap the benefits of.

I would think popular opinion will continue to swing into 2004.  G5 is a beast and the possabilities are huge on it.  We know in 2004 we will be at 3.0GHz in our PowerMac line.  That's huge!  We know that Panther has huge advancements in it.  Apple is becoming mainstream behind the scenes by pushing Kerberos in their OS and things like Active Directory support and such.  As they integrate more of the "rest of the world" into their OS, it will pick up users.

It's funny.  Apple's user base is actually increasing, from what I've read, despite their percentages decreasing.  It's a misleading statistic.  Remember, more and more people are buying computers.  It's just that the PC market, obviously, expands faster than Apple's does.  It doesn't necessarily indicate a loss of consumers or lack of growth.


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## Pengu (Jul 11, 2003)

Check out USB.org
down the bottom:


> Site sponsored by USB Implementers Forum, Inc., creators of USB technology



Go to the members list.
there are 922 members of the USB implementers forum, inc. goto http://www.usb.org/app/db/search/contacts/ for the full list.


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## Pengu (Jul 11, 2003)

Go3iverson, i was responding to MisterMe' post about intel buying usb.
I agree with you fully Go3.


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## Go3iverson (Jul 11, 2003)

Oh, I know, it was more directed back at Animus, who was the first saying that Apple doesn't build this and that, which is 100% true.  The thing is, they are the one's that ship it out.  We missed the boat on CD-R/CD-RW, but we set the trend in DVD-R.

Its give and take.


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## pyroboy (Jul 11, 2003)

Apple's biggest problem is price point. You can get a complete Dell system for around $499.00. The closest thing Apple has in that price range is $799 for an eMac and that's not even close.

Even  though the eMac is a great computer, if you don't know much and are comparing specs, the Dell seems to beat the Mac in every category.


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## Go3iverson (Jul 11, 2003)

It's a valid point.  Apple does make up a lot of ground and you go up the pricing scale.  I mean, 1999.00 for the 1.6GHz system is eh, but 2999.00 for the dual 2.0GHz with that huge drive, extra ram, PCI-X, etc is much more attractive!


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## AnimuS (Jul 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Pengu _
> *Check out USB.org
> down the bottom:
> 
> ...



thanks for clairfying its seems MisterMe didnt understand...


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## chevy (Jul 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by pyroboy _
> *Apple's biggest problem is price point. You can get a complete Dell system for around $499.00. The closest thing Apple has in that price range is $799 for an eMac and that's not even close.
> 
> Even  though the eMac is a great computer, if you don't know much and are comparing specs, the Dell seems to beat the Mac in every category. *



I don't know who you define that the Dell beats the eMac in every category (HD ? Noise ? Space used ? Processor ? RAM ? Included SW ?) but it definitely beats it on price which is the very first point for a lowest cost machine.


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## ApeintheShell (Jul 13, 2003)

innovate -
To change or alter by introducing something new; to remodel; to revolutionize.

gaming -
Evasive, trifling, or manipulative behavior

Microsoft -
The new Evil Empire (the old one was IBM). The
basic complaints are, as formerly with IBM, that (a) their system
designs are horrible botches, (b) we can't get source to fix them,
and (c) they throw their weight around a lot. 

Sony RS320 Desktop - A product designed to imitate the qualities or characteristics of something.

Arden-
An unincorporated city of north-central California, a residential suburb of Sacramento. Population: 49,130.

poser- 
a person who habitually pretends to be something he is not

 USB -
 Before March 1996 Intel started to integrate the necessary
 logic into PC chip sets and encourage other manufacturers
 to do likewise. It was widely available by 1997. Later
 versions of Windows 95 included support for it. It was
 standard on Macintosh computers in 1999.


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## ApeintheShell (Jul 13, 2003)

cheap -
 Relatively low in cost; inexpensive or comparatively inexpensive.

 Charging low prices: a cheap restaurant. 




Obtainable at a low rate of interest. Used especially of money.


 Devalued, as in buying power: cheap dollars. 




Achieved with little effort: a cheap victory; cheap laughs. 


Of or considered of small value: in wartime, when life was cheap. 


Of poor quality; inferior: a cheap pc.


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## Arden (Jul 13, 2003)

Yes, I've been to Arden Fair Mall, saw Minority Report there.  When I thought up "Arden Shik" for my online persona, I had little or no idea that Arden was the name of other stuff, but it's not like I care that much.

Pyroboy:  Post the specs for this cheapo depo Dell and the eMac, and I'll tell you which has superior specs and is, therefore, superior (not counting the OS).


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## Aeronyth (Jul 28, 2003)

Superiority doesn't matter in all cases, it's just the image of the price.  Any average family can go to Circuit City, or Best Buy, etc., and walk out the door with a computer that cost 500 dollars.  Why should they spend 1,299 for that iMac? 

As most of us know, the iMac is worth it (well, it's a tad bit overpriced, but..) and it has way better features than the $500 Compaq, but, to a lot of people, it doesn't matter.  They just need a computer, that gets on the internet, and prints things.  Which can be easily done in Windows.  Keep in mind that alot of people don't have the slightest clue about Apple computers, and with states like MN, having 1 apple store...they aren't likely to find out much about Apple.  That $500 system looks pretty nice to them.


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## nb3004 (Aug 3, 2003)

Another problem that ive found is that many people are exposed to mac's in school at an early age.  This is not a problem but must of these kids abuse these machines (at least they did where i went) and then were shcoked when things didnt worked.  So they think they are crap as they get older.  I think that mac's in schools are great, but they need people who now how they work and dont simply reply "i dont know" or "it cant do that"


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## Arden (Aug 4, 2003)

Yeah, I was talking with a friend one time and she said that Macs sucked based on her experience with old Apple II's (mind you, this was only a few years ago).  I laughed at her, telling her that those are crap and that modern Macs are nothing like that.


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## Satcomer (Aug 10, 2003)

> _Originally posted by arden _
> *Yeah, I was talking with a friend one time and she said that Macs sucked based on her experience with old Apple II's (mind you, this was only a few years ago).  I laughed at her, telling her that those are crap and that modern Macs are nothing like that. *



I now here from my friends how Apples Buymusic.com sucks so bad. So where is Apple Legal on the Apple image Buymusic.com is putting out? Nowhere!


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## Arden (Aug 10, 2003)

It's those stupid commercials.  They look like Apple commercials and draw you in, then punch you in the face and take off running.

Do you tell them the differences between BMDC and iTMS?


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## Satcomer (Aug 10, 2003)

> _Originally posted by arden _
> * Do you tell them the differences between BMDC and iTMS? *



Yes. However, for every person I know there is a least 10 others who don't even know an Apple user and still make a connection of the BMDC adds to Apple music. I'm afraid the damage has already been done.


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## chevy (Aug 15, 2003)

> _Originally posted by arden _
> *Yeah, I was talking with a friend one time and she said that Macs sucked based on her experience with old Apple II's (mind you, this was only a few years ago).  I laughed at her, telling her that those are crap and that modern Macs are nothing like that. *



Apple II are no crap.
Try a PC from the very same year and you'll what crap means !
1st you'll have to go to the end of the Apple II era as the PC was introduced in 1981
2nd you'll have no windows (or Windows) on this PC
3rd it's not as well integrated as the Apple II

And in 1984 comes the Mac !


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## Arden (Aug 15, 2003)

Chevy, I know that.  Apple II's weren't crap in their day, but would you use one today to get serious work done?  My point was that she was comparing modern PC's to Apple II's, which is like comparing a 350Z to a horse-and-buggy.  Obviously the 350Z will shred the buggy in any race.  What I had to explain was that modern Macs are nothing like those old Apple II's now.  I'd compare them more to a Lamborghini Diablo.  Now race _that_ against a 350Z.


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## chevy (Aug 16, 2003)

Try racing on a sand beach....


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## applewhore (Aug 16, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Lycander _
> *What is it that's really bothering you?  What is it that's missing for you then? *



Lycander, I obviously can't answer for Go3iverson, but it seems to me that he suffers from the same problem that most Mac-loving friends  of mine are afflicted with - I know I've certainly got it!

Basically, I "switched" when the PB 667 came out - I'd been using IBM ThinkPad's for EVER and thought they were the pinnacle of mobile computing at the time...

Then a  friend of mine turned up to a meeting with the "new" PB 400 - I was amazed...  and after a couple of months of convincing myself that I could still run all the software I used (basically M$ Office!) I bought a PB 667 for myself as a Christmas present in December 2001

Since then, I've found myself amazed that not EVERYONE I know has seen the light too!  I mean, I may be reasonably innovative, but it's so patently obvious, with XXX years of Windows usage, that the Mac OS makes sense...

as does the design of the hardware

as does the fact that everything works together...

So why doesn't everyone notice these things too and do the only thing that makes sense and move to using Apple??!?!

I just didn't understand it...

Then the friend who first put me on to Apple asked me an interesting question :

"But how would you feel if everyone had a 17" PB and a 23" Apple Display?"

Point taken!  As long as Apple can keep solvent, and making profits, I don't mind about the rest of the world...  Let them suffer the problems of bulky designs (or hardware-deficient laptops) and infinite blue screens - they're not my problem any more...

The frustration has gone away!  I don't want everyone to "understand" why Apple is better...  It would take away some of my "feel good" factor!

(I have, however, managed to convert everyone at work, my parents, sister and girlfriend to Apple though...

7 15" PBs and 3 15" iMacs in the last 18 months - not a bad start!)


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## Arden (Aug 16, 2003)

I have a deeper problem with the whole Mac vs. PC debate.  For me, it comes down to being a form of discrimination.  What is one of the major reasons, if not the biggest reason, software developers do not necessarily develop for the Mac?  They will not sell nearly as many as PC units.  So it's cheaper for the company just to sell to one market than to spend time becoming compatible with everyone.

Companies are required to offer minorities (as in ethnic minoritiesblacks, Asians, Hispanics, etc.) as equal an opportunity as anyone else.  They can't discriminate any ethnic groups if they might not make them as much money as another.  So why do software companies get to discriminate against users of different platforms?  We are consumers willing to buy a product who happen to use a Macintosh (or Linux box, or anything else besides Windows).  Why do they get to discriminate against us and treat us as second-hand citizens just because we prefer something different?


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## applewhore (Aug 16, 2003)

interesting idea, arden...

I wonder how that would stand up in court though?!!!


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## Arden (Aug 16, 2003)

The judge would probably rule in favor of the SW companies based on the concept of "bottom line."


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## malexgreen (Aug 17, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Go3iverson _
> *Really, when will it happen?
> [snip]
> Ok, that's enough for now. *



Plain and simple: Apple needs to prove over and over again via "bake-offs," benchmarks, and testimonials that Apple is the best solution for the desktop in corporate America, and that it's XServe line is the price/performance leader for small to medium storage and web/email servers. They also need to quickly come out with either a PPC970 or Power4 based XServe, to move into the enterprise market currently dominated by HP, IBM, and Sun.

They need to take advantage of the missteps of its compeitiors, like the fact Microsoft Server 2003 (MS's server and so called poster child for security) has been taken offline for www.windowsupdate.com because they are so scared that the W32/blahblahblah worm of the day will drop them on their behinds.

They need to make a bold move, and come out with a cheap and equally capable replacement for MS Office X. They need to make it stable, compatible, cheapter, and have a few wiz-bang very high demand features that make current MS Office X users say, "I gotta have it!"

They need to make MacOSX so compatible and as networkable with MS Windows that it easier to plug Apple computers together on a MS network than it is to plug MS Windows computer together on a MS network.

They need to advertise over and over and over again on TV, radio, and the internet, that a top of the line Mac IS CHEAPER than a top of line PC, and that a consumer priced Mac IS CHEAPER than a PC. They need to prove that TCO for a Mac is lower than a PC. 

That a Mac has higher quality than the PC quality leader.

They need to ask the question, which PC notebooks have gigabit ethernet? Which desktop PC's come with PCIX? Where's PCI Express? Hypertransport is in a product now. Maybe that says something about Hypertransport over PCI Express?


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## Arden (Aug 17, 2003)

I think, if Apple has promised to be at 3 Ghz in apx. 1 year (which should be when 10.4 comes out, at the current rate), they could easily surpass Intel and AMD in pure clock cycles.  Sure, "Mhz myth" and all that, but if Macs are faster than PC's with higher CPU speeds, imagine what Macs with higher CPU speeds would look like.  "Well, for one thing the G5 is faster per clock cycle than the P4, but it also has more of them per second than the P4.  Which do you think is faster?" (salesman to Joe Consumer)

Got any more stuff you can throw at us, malex?  You're on a roll...


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## Satcomer (Aug 20, 2003)

Here is something I'm becoming concerned about. It's the growing number of web sites that reject any computer that is not a Windows PC running the latest MS browser. I just seems that in the last 3 years it is steadily becoming the only way someone will be able to surf the NET is with a PC and Explorer.  It just seems inconceivable that a company would lock out out a segment of the population just to please Microsoft.  Or is it just plain laziness? 

On a side note, I made it a personal policy never to buy anything from a company that does that. I just believe the power of the pocket book is stronger than any ideology today.


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## malexgreen (Sep 2, 2003)

Looks like Apple is starting to focus on the Enterprise: http://www.thinksecret.com/news/enterprisegroup.html


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## Arden (Sep 3, 2003)

Sweet!


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## Go3iverson (Sep 11, 2003)

I almost wish that Apple hadn't brought G4 into all their computers, besides the iBook.

Think about it this way.  With the current sales trends of major PC manufacturers and the rumors of the G3 becoming supercharged and Altivec capable, having 3 chip lines would be great!

I would think that the eMac would be $200 less or so with a G3 in it, instead of G4, wouldn't you?  

G3 -> eMac, iBook, new small form factor tower.
G4 -> iMac, 12" PB, 15"PB, Dual 17" PB, XServe 1U, new small form factor tower.
G5 -> PowerMac, PB 15" (high end), PB 17", XServe 2U.

That would give the consumer many more options and pricing scales.

Apple could really use more than 1 line of desktop equipment.  Think about this:

1.2GHz G3, 256MB PC133, 40GB HD, 10/100, GeForce 3/4MX type with 32MB, small form factor:  $799.99

1.5GHz G4, 256MB DDR, 60GB HD, Gigabit, GeForce 4MX 32MB, small form factor:  $1199.99

1.6GHz G5:  $1599.99

People can pick their own display to fit their needs/space.  There'd also be a more entry level line available for the people that want towers, never had an Apple, and don't want to spend $1600.00 to try one out.

The laptops could use 3 chips to accomplish the same thing.  With a high end 15" and 17" having the G5 option and the 17" also having a dual G4 configuration.

Have any of you really looked at what comes in these $499.99 Dells?  Not much, IMO.  Apple's $799.99 desktop response may be a good push.  It'll also create more attention to the eMac with it's simular specs and built in monitor.

Just a thought.


As far as respect goes, I don't think they do...yet.  So many people are blind to Apple.  I was talking to someone today who wants an iPod for their PC desperately and didn't think Apple.com would sell them.  They weren't even 100% sure Apple made the product.

Over 1 million sold and some still don't make the connection.

I agree that things are turning around, especially with the computational cluster at VT and the Schaumburg iBook purchase.  G5 was the beginning and Panther should sway many more to the platform.


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## Arden (Sep 12, 2003)

Well, with your last point, or almost last point, many people are clueless about a lot of stuff.  Walk around your city, frequent the common hangouts, etc. and ask people if they voted in the last election or the last American Idol, and you'll probably get a lot more Idolizers, especially among the younger crowds.  The same goes for many topics; people just don't pay attention, especially if the topic is uninteresting.

I agree with you somewhat on the model options.  Apple should broaden the range of their products to more than just one chip per computer, and they should label them differently based on what's inside.  My 400 Mhz iMac says the exact same thing on the front as the lampshade models, "iMac," yet they are completely different machines.  They might do well to label their computers by year, much as car manufacturers do, because that would greatly decrease the confusion.  They should definitely not go back to the older method of using model numbers or letters, since it's quite confusing to distinguish a 6500 from an 8500 from a 9500, etc.  (I remember when the 8600's and 9600's were new, and I really wanted one!  Now I really want a G5. !)


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## Go3iverson (Sep 12, 2003)

I mean, my gf is a perfect example.

Before she met me, her mom bought her a computer as a gift.  It had a really nice looking GHz number.  She's happy but it always seems slow to her.  Then she meets me and my 867MHz tower.  Blows her machine away.

What is her machine with all it's GHz?  A Celeron.

The bargain PCs usually aren't machines any of us would use.  A super charged G3 with a cool form factor would destroy a machine like that.  We'd still be $200 over a bargain Dell, but we'd be getting people under the Apple roof.

That's our real goal here.  Find a way to get people to use the product.  Once they do, they want it and if they can, they buy it.  We have a top notch CPU now, I won't say if it is the top, but we know it's able to hang with the big boys.  We have an OS coming out which does everything Windows does, except crash.  If you thought people drooled over Aqua and bouncing icons, wait until you show them Expose.

This is the start of a critical time for Apple.  If Steve didn't pull out a G5 at WWDC, we may be singing a different tune right now.  Apple would have lost more respect and a ton of sales, as we can see with shipping times on our new silver clad machines.  Panther is ready to be prime time in an enterprise environment.

I'm not saying we're gonna ever be the 95% out there, but right now we have the attention of all 100%, we just have to  keep it in this positive manner.


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## ApeintheShell (Sep 29, 2003)

Mac Hacker....just tell them this:

So what's the problem? oh too much
So how much did your car cost you? oh, that is different.
Hmm, well it sucks to be you.
then walk away.


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