# MacOS X Sucks



## henry770 (Nov 12, 2000)

You people need to get a life and get a PC.  Macs are great and pretty, yet support nothing.  OS X is just like Win95 when it came out.  All kinds of problems that will take years to fix.  Apple didn't even write OS X completely.  It's just a Unix flavor with a Photoshop make over.


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## mtc7501 (Nov 12, 2000)

You do have a valid point with saying that MacOS X is like Windows 95 because there are problems that may take years to fix. There are currently problems, and there will most likely be problems for a while. However, I don't think that you can just say that MacOS X sucks. When it is completed, it may be better than Win95, but maybe not. One thing that Microsoft has proven a couple times is that sometimes *breaking* things is better than backwards compatibility. MacOS X is definitely breaking things. The future of the Macintosh platform is up in the air, and it could go either way-a better system, or a worse system.

I'm not going to sit here and bash any OS. My stance is that every operating system is better for certain purposes.


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## bolindilly (Nov 13, 2000)

"apple didn't write OS X completely."
^--hey henry770, are you stupid? what is the name of this software? it's a <b>beta</b>! it's development software. of course apple hasn't finished it yet. that just goes to show the ignorance of PC users...


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## phillies (Nov 13, 2000)

hmmm, I work on Macs since the Centris 650, quite a long time. now I use Mac and a Windows based system. 
Windows 2000 is stable and acceptable. The MacOsX beta is also very nice - I prefer it to windows, cause I have also some exprience with linux: so it's a very nice combination of both. 
However I see the problem in the hardware. I bought a MAC G4 450 in June and a AMD 900 Mhz a few weeks later. The AMD System was only 40% priced on the Macbox, in spite the fact, that it includes all the nice features like a DVD player, TV-ot, and so on. But the problem is, that the PC system is between 50 and 100% faster using for example Photoshop filters !!! (I have more RAM in the MACbox). 
That's in my opnion the real problem for Mac, much more expensive for a quite slow hardware.
I like Macs, but the company should adapt MaxOsX for PCs, too. If not, I think they won't survive the next 5 years.
S.
P.S.: sorry for my english skills, I have another mother tongue


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## jcbphi (Nov 13, 2000)

I hate to get involved in a debate over what sucks or not, but here's my 2 cents anyway:

Yes, OS X is a big break like Windows 95 was, and will probably face the same sorts of problems.  It takes time to track down bugs, etc. after you rewrite an entire operating system.  Still, I think the progress made in OS X is great, and am expecting a MUCH more polished OS by the time 1.0 is released.  Using OS X for the last 5 months, I've seen a far more stable OS than the Classic MacOS ever was.

Yes, Apple did not write most of OS X.  Almost the entire foundation was culled from Next, BSD, etc.  So what?  If it makes a better OS, then its a good idea.  Plus, if Macs didn't support a whole lot of software before, now they do.  In one environment, I can run classic MacOS, OS X, UNIX, and Java apps.

As for the "photoshop makeover", I don't see what's wrong with having a nice looking GUI frontend to your nice new OS.  If you really don't like the GUI, log in as '>console' and enjoy the beautiful command line.

And yeh, Mac hardware is slow and expensive.  I don't care what Apple ports OS X to, as long as it runs faster and doesn't cost me twice what I'd pay for a PC.  Those Athlon's are getting faster every day, and there's only so many G4's Apple can cram in a box.  No amount of  marketing can make up for chips running at half the clock speed.


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## AdmiralAK (Nov 14, 2000)

OS X sux ???
Well, all this is in the eye of the beholder  kind of discussion.
I can't argue with the guy with the cube & the 900Mhz AMD,
it's all perception.  If you want to have a _ valid _ commparison, I suggest
having the same configuration, or really close to it so that you can actually compare
accuratelly.

As far as OS X.
X was written by apple indirrectly.  Who was the president and founder of NeXT ?
Non other than steve Jobs.  Who is the CEO of apple now ?? Steve Jobs.  It's true that
OS X is a BSD flavor, but who cares ?  BSD is a very stable and secure OS.

As pointed out by the guy above me, a nice GUI is something to like about an OS.
Who the heck wants to use an ugly OS ?

and lastly.
I disagree that it will take OS X years to work out the bugs.  While it is a radical
departure from the original MacOS, the point of the beta to be distributed out in the public so much in advance is to have developpers make drivers for devices, for people to start making
and porting programs, AND to crush as many bugs in the OS as possible before the
final release's date of shipping.  Having the general public test it out is good because it is not a simulation of real life situations, it IS real life and so the bugs can be found.

Anyway, woudl all the PC people please leave and take tehir idiocy with them
because they are not going to change their mind settings no matter what.


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## henryhater (Nov 14, 2000)

henry770 is Daniel Henry a student at SPSU.  He runs win 2k and has reinstalled it over 20 times.  He is one of those morons that touchs the cupcake hooked up to the electric generator and doesn't learn his lesson.  If you would like to talk to him his phone number is (770) 499-2552.  You can also send him an e-mail at dhenry@spsu.edu.  The reason I know all this is because I am also a student at SPSU and I am a friend of his roomates.


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## x-snack (Nov 14, 2000)

hehe, i like such macusers  
i think i will mail him (or call)


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## webman2k (Nov 17, 2000)

Come on people, I'm an avid Mac user- got one at work and home.  Even though I'm a big fan of the Mac OS, there are some features that PC users have and we dont.  On the other hand, As nice as win 2000 is, there are some features that only Mac users can enjoy.  What I'm trying to say is that there is no perfect OS, and neither of them suck.  What we need is Apple and Microsoft to work together to make the perfect, unified OS that will bring world peace.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'll retreat into my delusions.


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## Ghoser777 (Nov 20, 2000)

> _Originally posted by webman2k _
> *Come on people, I'm an avid Mac user- got one at work and home.  Even though I'm a big fan of the Mac OS, there are some features that PC users have and we dont.  On the other hand, As nice as win 2000 is, there are some features that only Mac users can enjoy.  What I'm trying to say is that there is no perfect OS, and neither of them suck.  What we need is Apple and Microsoft to work together to make the perfect, unified OS that will bring world peace.
> 
> Now if you'll excuse me, I'll retreat into my delusions. *



To heck with microsoft.  They don't have a creative instinct in any of their products (except fpr thei roptical mouse, which was pretty cool).  But they are good at one thing - stealing.  As far as I can tell, almost everything that is so "innovative" about Windows came from either NeXT or Apple.  They just had the advantage of working with the major platform, x86.

When they force you to use a browser (not that I don't use it sometimes), when they crush competition, etc, I find it hard to support that kind of a company.  On the other hand, when a company has a CEo like Steve Jobs who puts to much pressure on his people, tries to kill all dissension withing apple (killing rumors, that whole "pirates" thing, etc), egtc, apple has its own problems.  So I'm more pissed about the whole business mindset of the two companies.  Why can't apple be completely the good guy we want it to be?  Life would be so much easier if we could always take the moral high gorund all of the time instead of most of the time.

Grr.... makes me want to start a coup in both apple and microsoft...

F-bacher


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## MacRebell (Nov 20, 2000)

Get lost you and you pussy metal box piece of shit PC. By the way you should get a life; Unix and MacOS was here way before that Winshit and will be here way after it too, simply because it is better. And Billy G. Jurk will have to accept it and join the UNIX community or the Unix will get ride of Billy Boy.

Aufwiedersehen du PC Scheisser.


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## mtc7501 (Nov 20, 2000)

> _Originally posted by Ghoser777 _
> To heck with microsoft.  They don't have a creative instinct in any of their products (except fpr thei roptical mouse, which was pretty cool). [/B]



I just thought that I would point out that Microsoft wasn't the first company to make optical mice. I had been using an optical mouse on my computer for 3 years or so before microsoft released theirs. They did however, make it so that the optical mouse did not require a special mouseplate. Which was actually pretty innovative.


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## AdmiralAK (Nov 21, 2000)

The first optical mouse I saw was on a Sun station 5 years ago 
but it had to have a special mousepad lol...what a drag


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## Piet Keizer (Nov 22, 2000)

The first replies in this thread surprised me because of their reasonability. Usually, Mac users get pretty unreasonable when people say their platform is dead.

Thus, the latter replies are very disappointing.

I use Mac and PC, but the Mac is my most commonly used computer.

My experience on Macs supporting nothing is that I miss nothing except games (which I'm not running on my PC either, so I apparently don't really care).

Things that are supported on PC and not on Mac, are usually not top pruducts.

I'm not a techie, but I see OS X as a heroic undertaking, which should be cherished with patience and optimism. (just like Microsofts 'Whistler', which must be a hell of a job, too. For a company like MS.)


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## jove (Nov 28, 2000)

This is the first thread I have seen here comprised mostly of FUD.


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## fatih (Dec 6, 2000)

<blockquote><b>>You people need to get a life and get a PC.<BR>>Macs are great and pretty, yet support nothing. OS X is <br>>just like Win95 when it came out. All kinds of problems <br>>that will take years to fix. Apple didn't even write OS X<br>>completely. It's just a Unix flavor with a Photoshop<br>> make over.</b></blockquote>

<p align="left">/* Begin SHOUTING!... */<h4><b>HEY Henry YOU SUCK! and MAC OS X DOES NOT! What do you mean 'just a Unix flavor'? Show me better OS than Unix? You can't. Windo$$ has been sucking almost a decade now. And every computer user say prayer before they touch their Windo$(__)(__)! 
</b></h4> /*End SHOUTING*/</p>

<U>Fatih uses FreeBSD. OpenBSD, Mac OS X and proud of them!
Fatih thanks Apple giving an opprtunity who are sick of Microcrap!</U>
___________________________________
G4 Cube 450 512 MB -->> Mac OS X
Athlon 800 256 MB -->> FreeBSD
___________________________________


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## Angus_D (Dec 9, 2000)

uhm... OS X doesn't "suck" in my opinion. 
Mac OS X does support things. It supports the myriad of programs for Mac OS 9 and below via Classic and with some work via Carbon. Any NeXTStep/OpenStep apps should work on it with some porting. And last, but by no means least, it supports most UN*X apps, but they need a little bit of work to iron out incompatibilities.

Cocoa is a very efficient, cool framework that enables application development to be much more streamlined than ever before.

Carbon enables all Mac OS developers to use their current skills to develop great Mac OS X apps.

And best of all, developers are interested in Mac OS X and it has FREE DEVELOPMENT TOOLS. This way more and more programs will be supported.


I fully understand the logic behind Apple's decision to use RISC... It's definitely a superior technology to CISC processors such as Intel's x86/Pentium range. However, Motorola has much less R&D funding than Intel does, so progression will be slower.

Apple is really banging Mot tho because everybody realises that even though Steve Jobs can do Photoshop bakeoff after bakeoff, nobody will believe it until they pump up the MHz. 

And I dispute the statement that most of OS X wan't written by Apple - NeXT is now part of Apple, and they wrote a load of it, but loads of the actual OS is written by Apple. It was ported to PPC by Apple.


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## AdmiralAK (Dec 9, 2000)

OS X might have it's bases in NeXT, and it might not be
considered an apple product, but guess who the founder and
president of NeXT was....non other than Steve Jobs, yep, the guy who created apple as well with a few other guys such as Wozniak.
While OS X might not be the child of apple directly, it is the evolution of Job's project and as far as I am concerned
Jobs is apple.  He brought the company back from financial hell.
The only thing I regret is that he whas not used any of the newton technologies in macs.  Can you imagine the posibilities if macs can built in with 100% handwritting support and voice support?
It would be damned nice 
(Hey by the way, what happened to speech recognition and speakable items in OS X ? lol )


Admiral


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## jove (Dec 11, 2000)

"(Hey by the way, what happened to speech recognition and speakable items in OS X ? lol )"

I have found references to them in the developer's docs. Hopefully they just are not complete yet.


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## latourfl (Dec 15, 2000)

I believe that speach technology as well as handwritting recognition could make the Mac more powerfull and distinctive. This technology is part of the Mac for a few years, and I would like to see it improved with OS X... 

In fact, even if the first comparison with Win95 surprised and shocked me, we can hope one thing: if with their big publicity campain Microsoft sold like bread a piece of crap, Apple can do it's best to promote it's power with this new tool on the Mac. The world need to know that OS X is the best, and I'm judging it seriously, not just because I love the Mac anyway...

So a computer that greets you with speach as soon as it is out of the box would be terrific. My iMac came with a step by step installater of an internet acces (can't remeber the name). It was impressive: the voice commands guiding you... And with QT, they promoted the possibility to make "help movies". Well now is the time for Apple to impress us... Make it all vocal, video, whatever, but make it great!


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## AppleWatcher (Dec 15, 2000)

Yeah, I know this discussion for years.

But I think Henry DOESN'T have Mac OS X, and that he has only once seen an Apple IIe or something.

If Henry should have Mac OS X, he would know 'the power of Aqua', even in a Beta version.

And then, Henry is talking about <STRIKE> Windowz 95 </STRIKE> - Sorry guys that I'm using this word  - !

How do you dare? And in what year do you live?
I think he's using <word above striked>, and that he has seen http://www.apple.com/macosx/aqua and he can't believe it's a button so he only mad and he thinks it's made with Photoshop - for Mac, of course. 

Come on Henry. You're here on macosx.com 
else goto http://www.ilikewindows95soverymuchthatithinkmacosxbetawasmadewith-
photoshop.com

AppleWatcher


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## rene (Dec 31, 2000)

The Mac OS always had features Windows copied in a bad way, I think.
What I like about Mac OS 9 (classic) is its HIGH degree of customisebility.
You can change almost te whole OS..(the look anyway LOL)
And all with such ease of use. Like with programs like Kaleidoscope and stuff.
Ok, extensions cause conflicts but they can do funny things (just drop an extension
in the extensions folder and suddenly your Mac will play piano,LOL)
OS X (OS 10!) is still an infant, I am sure all the ways to make it a pleasnt OS as
9 will be dreamed up for OS X as well.
I hope so, anyway!!
In my opinion an OS should confirm to your wishes and not the other way round.
...OS 9 does, OS X doesnt (yet, I hope)
Forget windows, it is a boring sterile OS. The reason I love Mac is becoz the OS
always had a lot of humor in it, much ease of use and so on.
I use windows in Virtual PC, I do not like it..It always has me beating around the bush.
One of the prime things of the Mac OS is Sherlock..want to find somethin on your drive, or on the web.. Sherlock will take care of it! And fast too!
To my knowledge there is no such app build into windows. (hahahahaha)

Oh, and pleae to all of you who speak about Mac OS X version 1.0...
STOP!! you mean Mac OS 10 1.0? just stop it 

and now: PLEAD to dedicated Mac users..
My comments are about the way you minimize windows in OS X.
I have mentioned this to Apple, but only now did I realize HOW IMPORTANT it really is. 
In my opinion the FUTURE of the Mac OS (and Apple computers) could depend on it.
(as far as being a pleasant OS and the leader in the graphic field is concerned)
Let\'s say I am working in my favorite graphics or webdesign program...Sometimes I am
working on 5 documents at the same time, copying and pasting from one document to the other. 
If one or more documents (or pallettes for that matter) are in the way, I can just click the titlebalk
and it/they collapse to a neat bar. I can then drag them out of the way, but can easily find again when
I want to work on it again, coz\' they remain on the desktop.(this is such a COOL feature, only the Mac OS has it!)
Then I imagined the same scenario working in Mac OS X... HORROR!!Every document or palette would 
dissappear into the dock BUT...in the dock are many, many icons already (no Apple menu, you see...)
What HORROR it will be to find the right document again between all those tiny icons...
(want to work on \'doc.1\'...first go to the dock, find it,work on it, click it to send it to the dock again,
want to work on \'doc.2\'...first go to the dock, find it, click it... NEED I GO ON?)
I really and strongly believe that the \'old\' way of minimizing SHOULD be maintained in OS X.
There SHOULD be an option to choose between OS 9 style and OS X style minimizing,
becoz when working in graphics or webdesign applications the \'new\' style is HIGHLY impractible!

If you agree with me, please go over to Apple\'s Mac OS X feedback page to voice your opinion
http://www.apple.com/macosx/beta/feedback.html

If we do it NOW we might still be in time!
Okee, thank you!


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## Nick (Jan 2, 2001)

There seems some confusion here, I have an Athlon 1000Mhz, and a G4 500Mhz, when running any Photoshop command the G4 is about 64% faster. Both machines have 128MB RAM available for Photoshop. The athlon is running Windows ME, the G4 OS 9.01. When running OS X on G4 it still beats the Athlon in Classic mode. May be the previous comparison forgot to adjust the memory allocated in Photoshop for the Mac??
As for OS X, I have given it 8/10, to put this into perspective Windows ME gets 4/10. OS X will have some problems but no where near as many as Windows NT, 2000, ME, 98....
May be before people compare operating systems they should learn how to use them. I suggest it is rarely the operating system at fault, more often an arogent incompetant user who fails to recognise their own failures.
May be I\'m unfair, but Apple OS\'s are always faster than Wintel equivalents for major work, Mac\'s are sometimes slow, Wintel boxes usually crash and die given a sniff of serious work. (Try rendering a 1.3GB CMYK Photoshop file on a 1.1GhzAthlon and see how far that gets before the Mac has finished)


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## smileyq (Jan 11, 2001)

I'll start off by telling you what I do. I'm a system administrator for a rather large isp. I will admit that I tend to be a huge UNIX fan because of my job but that doesn't matter in this situation. 
Mac OS X is something that windows users just can't and won't understand. I am a windows user mcse, have a pc , own ibooks powerbooks and a G4. As with any OS out there its only what you make it. If you look into OS X what can you say you dont' like about  it. Is it not fast enough for you? hmm fast for me... Is it not robust enough and powerfull enough for you? hmm well it does more than windows can at the moment because of the BSD kernel. Oh yea.. are you saying it sucks because it doesnt crash when one simple app crashes? Well I'll stop bashing because as I said I'm a multiplatform user. But the point being you can't diss something you know nothing about and have no clue the power of. In my opinion this could be the best consumer OS to ever hit the market. I guess we will all see but me I will have my copy March 24. Its up to  you if you want to learn yourself.
-Smileyq


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