# Think Different....AGAIN...



## BBenve (Feb 11, 2003)

Just wanted to share something... that we should all read ... think of... and ACT differently after we have read it...

THERE IS A LESSON TO BE LEARNT HERE 

If you lived as a child in the 70's or the 80's, looking 
back, it's hard to believe that we have lived as long as we 
have........ 

As children, we would ride in cars with no seat belts or air 
bags. 

Our baby cots were covered with bright coloured lead-based 
paint. 

We had no childproof lids on medicine bottles, doors, or 
cabinets, and when we rode our bikes, we had no helmets. 
(Not to mention hitchhiking to town as a young kid!) 

We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle. 
Horrors. 

We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and 
then rode down the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes. 
After running into the bushes a few times we learned to solve the 
problem. 

We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as long 
as we were back when the streetlights came on. No one was able to 
reach us all day. No mobile phones. Unthinkable. 

We played dodgeball and sometimes the ball would really 
hurt. 

We got cut and broke bones and broke teeth and there were no 
lawsuits from these accidents. They were accidents. No one was to 
blame but us. Remember accidents? 

We had fights and punched each other and got black and blue 
and learned to get over it. 

We ate cakes, bread and butter, and drank sugary pop but 
we were never overweight.........we were always outside playing. 

We shared one bottle of pop with four friends, from one 
bottle and no one died from this? 

We did not have Playstations, Nintendo 64, X Boxes, video 
games and all 99 channels on Sky Digital TV, video tape movies, 
surround sound, personal mobile phones, Personal Computers, 
Internet chat rooms........we had friends. We went outside and found 
them. 

We rode bikes or walked to a friend's home and knocked on 
the door, or rung the bell or just walked in and talked to them. 
Imagine such a thing. Without asking a parent! By ourselves! 

Out there in the cold cruel world! Without a guardian. How 
did we do it? 

We made up games with sticks and tennis balls and ate worms 
and although we were told it would happen, we did not put out very 
many eyes, nor did the worms live inside us forever. 

Our actions were our own. Consequences were expected. No one 
to hide behind. 

The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke a law was 
unheard of. They actually sided with the law, imagine that! 

This generation has produced some of the best risk-takers 
and problem solvers and inventors, ever. The past 50 years has been 
an explosion of innovation and new ideas. We had freedom, failure, 
success and responsibility, and we learned how to.


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## wdw_ (Feb 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by BBenve _
> *We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle.
> Horrors.
> 
> ...



I used to do all that stuff. I once shared a bottle of sprite with my friend...but we found it burried in the ground. You sayin' you're generation is better than mine? Well them sound like fightin' words. 4pm, after school, behind the slide. Be there.



Seriously though. That was a nice post. I just don't quite get what you're trying to say.

PS. you might like the movie Bowling For Columbine.


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## BBenve (Feb 11, 2003)

well... what i am trying to say.. is... we used to be more happy relaxed and free.... today you look at post..people just try to find anything to fight..it's either a bad reply ... or something else..people do not read post as they probably are supposed to...
The fact is that we re too worried about our  opinion we do not even read post in the correct way anymore...and this goes for everything else...even outside your roomm....

i just miss the day i used to do stupid thing...and people were with me not against... the day i did stupid things..and everyone did the same... the day i used to be myself and no one sued me or did anything bad for it...

My post was just a waty to say...take it easy... we were able to survive without this anger... we will be able once again...if we try


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## pds (Feb 11, 2003)

I think it's saying that today's over-attention to being safe and protecting us from ourselves may have unforseen consequences. Those consequences are connected to a climate of blaming others and seeing ourselves as victims. Personal responsibility CAN (might-could-sometimes does) become a casualty of the present climate of keep it safe, clean and "fair." Witness the guy that blames Ronald McDonald for turning him into a lard farm. 

But then it may be that from the wreakage of a molly-coddled and overprotected age comes a forceful reaction of innovation and development. 

It is the human spirit that develops and innovates and that is not developed by germs shared anymore than it is fostered by bottled water.


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## wdw_ (Feb 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by BBenve _
> *well... what i am trying to say.. is... we used to be more happy relaxed and free.... today you look at post..people just try to find anything to fight..it's either a bad reply ... or something else..people do not read post as they probably are supposed to...
> The fact is that we re too worried about our  opinion we do not even read post in the correct way anymore...and this goes for everything else...even outside your roomm....
> 
> ...


You're talking about a minority of people. Most people aren't sueing somebody else of stupid little things and I think the ratio of argumentative posters to thoughtful, polite posters is low. The people who complain usually to have more to say, so it seems like there's a lot of arguing. I'm not saying I haven't gotten into a heated debate at macosx.com, most memorably over the proper use of the phrase "doo doo brain".

Just ignore people who fight. DON'T FEED THE TROLLS!!


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## Sogni (Feb 11, 2003)

> As children, we would ride in cars with no seat belts or air
> bags.



I always wore a seatbelt...

But I can argue with anyone about death bags - err I mean air bags and instant-acordian/leg crusher cars - err I mean "crumple zone" cars to no end! 

*forcing myself to stop here before I turn this into a rant*


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## MDLarson (Feb 11, 2003)

Everybody is obsessed with safety these days.  Nothing wrong with safety per se, it's just maybe overdone (in my opinion.)


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## jocknerd (Feb 11, 2003)

I was a kid in the 70's as well. Before the days of video games. Well, Pong was out. But I didn't get an Atari until around 1980.
Get this, you young'ens. We used to play outside all day during the summer. We'd pack our lunches and actually go play baseball for hours at a time. Or at least it seemed like it at the time. We'd play with our Evel Knievel toys and SST (or SSP) cars in the street. Before remote control. All this without adult supervision! Heck my mom didn't have a problem leaving me at home while she went up to the grocery store. And I was 10 years old. She'd be locked up today.

Those were the days!


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## fryke (Feb 11, 2003)

Ehm... Please make sure you open those threads in the right forums.


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## banjo_boy (Feb 11, 2003)

> _Originally posted by wdw_ _
> *PS. you might like the movie Bowling For Columbine. *



Mike Moore is nothing close to what we grew up as. Just an undirected moron that gets to rant. I thought his first movie about Flint, MI was stupid and mindless drivel. What I don't lie about his movies is his capitalizes on peoples pain. Yes, guns kill. Yes, the two kids killed classmates. But why, make money off the victims. I love his stupidity of going into a small town, opening a bank account, and getting a gun for doing so. And his point is....? 

I loved BBenve's post. We did have a fun but WE were held responsible for what we did and at the same time we did not try to blame someone else for the window we broke. Our generation will make the difference in the future. We have already. We have yet to master the "learn from history" saying but we have done better than our parents.

My point about Moore is he is a result of the stupidity and so called "cautiousness" our country has adopted. I went through Jr. and Sr. high with people in GUN CLUB. This means they BROUGHT GUNS to school. No one was shot. No one was threatened. Our society has totally killed people sense of confrontation, calmness, and kindness for others.


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## Ugg (Feb 11, 2003)

I don't like Michael Moore because he is an obese, white, loudmouthed, unkempt American.  However, his movie "Bowling for Columbine" is the highest grossing documentary of all time.  Whether I like him OR his movie is irrelevant.  What is important is that lots of people are going to see it in part to understand what caused the Columbine massacre.  

I grew up in a small town in Montana.  In the High School parking lot, it was unusual to find a pickup that did not have at least a .22 in the gun rack.  However, guns were never, ever allowed in the school during school hours.  It was only after school for gun safety class or gun club.  

Of course, in the late 70's guns were meant to kill animals, like gophers, coyotes, magpies and the occasional wolverine.  Sure, people were killed, like the guy who was found dead in his pickup after his gun discharged after he went over a big bump in the road.  The gun was in the gun rack in the back window of his pickup.  Everyone felt bad, but ya know what anybody stupid enough to leave a gun loaded in the vehicle deserved to be shot is what everyone said.  

We were taught to respect guns and there were very few in my age group, male or female who by the age of ten hadn't seen an animal killed.  In middle school, we dissected a calf.  In High School, a horse.  When you live in the country you learn early about life and about death and that guns can kill.  

Drugs came late to Montana, but they were definitely there in the late 70's and they changed life in our little town.  Neither of the town's two banks failed during the depression, few towns can make such a claim.  The Dutch and Belgian settlers who made up the majority of the early population didn't allow themselves to get caught up in the crazy 20's.  The Two World Wars barely made a dent.  Even Vietnam came and went quietly.  

Drugs came and stayed and changed the town irrevocably.  Then came the box stores, and people could buy guns without knowing how to use them.  Without seeing first hand the damage that could be done with one.  Hollywood taught us that no matter how many times Arnold Schwarzenegger was shot he would rise again.  Hollywood has recently honored Scoresese (sp).  He has made some of the most gratuitously violent films ever, and we applaud him, praise him for his efforts and revile the child who "learns" how to kill by watching his movies.  

In our pursuit for money and instant gratification we have forgotten that decency to our fellow humans needs to come first, and that living in a sterile, gated, suburb is the first step towards social alienation.  

Have you ever seen a columbine flower?  It is one of the most delicate flowers imaginable, yet in its wild state exists in the extreme north of Alaska.  

Before the late 70's did you ever hear of a city named after a flower?  Why is that do you think?  Personally I think that here in America we continually abandon that which is old rather than deal with the problems that will always arise.  We are still living with a frontier mentality.  The grass is always greener on the other side of the hill, the next town will be kinder, gentler, more compassionate.  The next town will have more people like us.  Until we end our transient, environmentally destructive ways, I doubt that we will ever be free of events like the Columbine massacre.  That is until we legislate ourselves into a Soviet-like state where the people are not allowed to make decisions for themselves and only the "enlightened" like Arschcroft, Rummy and dubya are allowed to make the decisions.  Because after all, Father Knows Best............


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## Trip (Feb 12, 2003)

What an amazingly inspirational post.
All of the things stated are not only true for most of us, but they are true for all of us. *runs to print it out*


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## banjo_boy (Feb 12, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Ugg _
> *That is until we legislate ourselves into a Soviet-like state where the people are not allowed to make decisions for themselves and only the "enlightened" like Arschcroft, Rummy and dubya are allowed to make the decisions.  Because after all, Father Knows Best............ *



Don't forget "Bubba knows best..."

Just like "You need universal health care", "People can't help themselves out of welfare", "I feel your pain" and my favorite "It takes a village".

We are far from a Soviet state and to blame the current administration isn't smart. For one thing, if it was extreme right wing, it would be a Nazi state. Communist is extreme left. For another, We have NEVER seen that kind of control in our country and friends of mine who DID live in Communist Russia do not want it.

Yes, George W might be a hawk, but he has evidence that can't be revealed to everyone. But, Pres. Clinton and her husband did have there very close to communist agenda ie univ helathcare, extremely expanded welfare, etc.

I am just happy we live in a country where we can make our opinions known without getting shot or worse.

And always remember this, every village has an idiot or two.


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## Trip (Feb 12, 2003)

No, not every village has an idiot.
Norht Carolina for example.


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## banjo_boy (Feb 13, 2003)

But you do have to watch out sometimes.

I have three kids myself and I wish I could just let them do what I did as a kid. I think children of today are really missing out.


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## iGuy (Mar 3, 2003)

Nice to remember, I guess.  Child of the seventies?  Heck, I am a child of the sixties.  Back then, sex was dirty and the air was clean.


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## cellfish (Mar 4, 2003)

Maybe it's just me but I actually think that this is the best thing I've read in a long time. Very well done. Whoever wrote it originally deserves a lot of praise.


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## doemel (Mar 4, 2003)

I think a lot of the so called dangers that we are afraid of today and today's parents are worried about their children getting exposed to are overemphasized by the media because they need stories that sell and nothing sells as good as fear. I have grown up in the 80's, my family did have a TV but we hardly ever watched anything. Instead me and my brothers/sister were outside all the time playing, getting hurt, "eating" dirt, hanging out with other kids that might beat us up or that we'd beat up if we could etc. etc. etc. My grandfathers both had a herd of sheep, land to take care of and more, and there was nothing like going on a day of work with either of them. Hell, I got kicked over by a charging ram once and I don't know how many times my mom fixed those holes in my pants just around the knee. Did you ever compare how many kids you find today on a Saturday afternoon at the places where you used to play to how many you'd find on a Saturday back when you were a kid? I get scared sometimes because many places are totally abandoned and you know that today's kids are at home watching TV or sitting in front of the computer. There's nothing wrong with that (in fact I have fond memories of playing games on my friends' computers... Commodore64, Amiga, heck, even a 286 with DOS!) but what makes the difference is moderate use! You also have to show today's kids how much fun playing "low-tech" games (or just plain old "playing in the dirt" for that matter) can be! I will try hard to do that if I have kids one day.

Hum, I guess I got carries away a bit, sorry if my post doesn't have a clear structure but I guess some of you will understand what I'm trying to say.


P.S.: It'd not even that much about growing up in a city or on the countryside. Although I agree that the possibilities for "adventures" can be found easier at places like where I grew up (Ausserberg, a small mountain village in the heart of the Swiss Alps)


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## Cat (Mar 4, 2003)

> I got kicked over by a charging ram once


Me too!  My problem was that it was still a little lamb, and the little buggers head fitted nicely into my stomach ... ouch! My mom used to cut off my torn jeans out of desperation of mending them and patching them (I had patches on my patches, just like windoze!). It's true that most kids now stay more indoor than  15 - 20 years ago, but that is a consequence of changing customs and habits: less social control for instance and more individualism. On the other hand, old folks used to complain about the youths bad habits since the roman empire ...  ... I now live in a littl evillage on the edge of a big city and the children here definitely have a lot of adventures, chasing frogs, walking on thin ice, throwing stones at birds, etc. 
I think the problem is that people are over-sensitive and paranoid about any kind of danger, however small. Hygiene & safety can be exaggerated too and over-protectiveness makes kids isolated and shy. I'm very happy my mother let be and discover some of the dangers of the world all by myself. Burnt kids shun the fire. Did work great for me!  So it will for my future children too.


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