GUI Suggestions (screenshot)
- Thread starter bellboy
- Start date
AdmiralAK
Simply Daemonic
True there is the favorites menu but its not quite the same.
I did not use the apple menu that much, infact I only used it to go to
the control panels and a few select apps (like DVD player), and I do not have
much of an argument to bring it back <b>BUT</b> the apple menu
has been a staple of the MacOS ever since day one, and even when there was a
MacOS version on the AppleIIgs.
I think that the apple menu can be of greater use to some people than it can with me,
but a MacOS without an Apple menu is kinda weird...
As for the process menu on the left (Where it shows all teh apps that are running)
well that I really don;t want back. I have the dock for that, and I think the dock does a better job
at it. (and it has all those pwetty little icons too
C'est tout
I did not use the apple menu that much, infact I only used it to go to
the control panels and a few select apps (like DVD player), and I do not have
much of an argument to bring it back <b>BUT</b> the apple menu
has been a staple of the MacOS ever since day one, and even when there was a
MacOS version on the AppleIIgs.
I think that the apple menu can be of greater use to some people than it can with me,
but a MacOS without an Apple menu is kinda weird...
As for the process menu on the left (Where it shows all teh apps that are running)
well that I really don;t want back. I have the dock for that, and I think the dock does a better job
at it. (and it has all those pwetty little icons too
C'est tout
I've made some changes to the layout.... check it out.
http://www.generated.com/macosx/new_layout2.jpg
Thoughts.
I rearranged the menus at the top, bringing the "apple menu" to the right, and moving the app menu back to the left. I still think that the "apple menu" should remain, in the form of the current "Go" menu, only with drag and drop features.
I made a small change to the dock. Basically, I don't think that the dock needs to be changed much from it's current form. What I think should change though is this; There should be some sort of obvious separation between what apps are running, and which are not. This is handled by simply having all running app icons on the left of the double line. On the right of the double line would be any alias you might have placed in the dock. Now, if you click on one of the alias', the icon would move from the right of the line to the left (using the growing/shrinking animation from when you open/close an app that isn't in the dock already). You'll notice that there aren't arrows under each app that is running now. I think that the arrow should only be under the app that you are currently using (in conjunction with the app menu in the top bar). Additionally, any hidden apps should have their icons more transparent than the others. All window management should be handled by the specific app that is running, in the "window" menu.
http://www.generated.com/macosx/new_layout2.jpg
Thoughts.
I rearranged the menus at the top, bringing the "apple menu" to the right, and moving the app menu back to the left. I still think that the "apple menu" should remain, in the form of the current "Go" menu, only with drag and drop features.
I made a small change to the dock. Basically, I don't think that the dock needs to be changed much from it's current form. What I think should change though is this; There should be some sort of obvious separation between what apps are running, and which are not. This is handled by simply having all running app icons on the left of the double line. On the right of the double line would be any alias you might have placed in the dock. Now, if you click on one of the alias', the icon would move from the right of the line to the left (using the growing/shrinking animation from when you open/close an app that isn't in the dock already). You'll notice that there aren't arrows under each app that is running now. I think that the arrow should only be under the app that you are currently using (in conjunction with the app menu in the top bar). Additionally, any hidden apps should have their icons more transparent than the others. All window management should be handled by the specific app that is running, in the "window" menu.
endian
Dis Member
just a general comment about putting launcher menus, application switcher menus back into OSX...
IMO one of the best things about Aqua is the revised menu layout. The ONLY things in the menu bar right now are the menus belonging to the active application. Under classic MacOS you have the apple menu, the app switcher menu, the menubar clock (which isnt even a menu), plus any menus put there by extensions/control panels. Either the menu bar belongs to the application or it belongs to the system - having parts of it belong to both is not the best way of organizing things.
IMO one of the best things about Aqua is the revised menu layout. The ONLY things in the menu bar right now are the menus belonging to the active application. Under classic MacOS you have the apple menu, the app switcher menu, the menubar clock (which isnt even a menu), plus any menus put there by extensions/control panels. Either the menu bar belongs to the application or it belongs to the system - having parts of it belong to both is not the best way of organizing things.
Any developers out there? Maybe these idea should be turned into reality, whether Apple wants to act on them or not. Personally, I feel that Apple is thinking more about marketing and less about useability, so the only way to change this is by giving users alternatives and see what they choose.
For me the bin is the wrong place and things that don't stay still annoy me.
[Edited by ajmas on 10-18-2000 at 10:35 AM]
For me the bin is the wrong place and things that don't stay still annoy me.
[Edited by ajmas on 10-18-2000 at 10:35 AM]
endian
Dis Member
i've redone the screenshots i have up at http://www.mimicry.org/img/sshots/ to make them look nicer. that's all i have to say right now
Personally I think that the dock has it's place, but only for newbie users and people who don't use their Macs very often - something like the current launcher. My main problem with the dock is that it takes up too much space, thereby limiting the amount of docs and apps that it can provide access to. And the smaller the icons get the less info they provide, plus it isn't universally accessible.
I would like to see an option to turn it off, and to incorporate it's functionality into the new top-left "application" menu. My idea would be to have two sub-menus under there, one would be labeled "Run..." and would include all your aliases to start apps, and the other would be "Switch to..." and would hold all the apps that are currently running.
Perhaps the "Switch to..." submenu could also kick out further sub-menus to the windows of the individual documents that that app has open. I don't see the point of adding another menu to the left of the app menu.
I am not running Mac OS X, (still on 8.6) and I am basing my knowledge of the dock from Apple's website and other places, but I think that either Apple should incorporate these menus, or some 3rd party developer should release a program to do this.
I would like to see an option to turn it off, and to incorporate it's functionality into the new top-left "application" menu. My idea would be to have two sub-menus under there, one would be labeled "Run..." and would include all your aliases to start apps, and the other would be "Switch to..." and would hold all the apps that are currently running.
Perhaps the "Switch to..." submenu could also kick out further sub-menus to the windows of the individual documents that that app has open. I don't see the point of adding another menu to the left of the app menu.
I am not running Mac OS X, (still on 8.6) and I am basing my knowledge of the dock from Apple's website and other places, but I think that either Apple should incorporate these menus, or some 3rd party developer should release a program to do this.
OS X is really simple! I'd like to keep it that way as follows:
Normally you have the Application menu and the Dock. It would be nice to be able to hide the Dock using a keyboard shortcut or mouse click somewhere on the Dock.
When the Dock is hidden the menus in the menu bar should slide one to the right in an animated manner. Then the happy face icon would appear on the left most position in the menu bar. This happy face menu will include all the items in the Dock. Docked folders will appear as submenus.
This means that you have access to your favorite docked applications and folders. You can also switch between running applications.
In other words, "Turn the Dock into a menu when hidden."
I think this keeps it simple and is just as powerful. You would be able to see the icons and their names.
Normally you have the Application menu and the Dock. It would be nice to be able to hide the Dock using a keyboard shortcut or mouse click somewhere on the Dock.
When the Dock is hidden the menus in the menu bar should slide one to the right in an animated manner. Then the happy face icon would appear on the left most position in the menu bar. This happy face menu will include all the items in the Dock. Docked folders will appear as submenus.
This means that you have access to your favorite docked applications and folders. You can also switch between running applications.
In other words, "Turn the Dock into a menu when hidden."
I think this keeps it simple and is just as powerful. You would be able to see the icons and their names.
This post is mostly in reply to bellboy's previous post.
First, I like your ideas for the Apple menu. However, since this is a new interface and all, why not keep it the "Go" menu. "Go" is much more intuitive than an Apple in the corner. Go would be available in all apps, where the top portion (i.e. the stable, non-moving portion) would be system-wide links, and a subsection below that links specific to navigating the currently selected application.
Second, I disagree that Quit should be moved to the File menu. Yes, I'm use to it, and so is everyone else, and yes, I feel "uncomfortable" whenever I automatically open "File" and can't find it there. However, this level of uncomfortability actually HELPS in that when I do find Quit under the App menu, I absolute know, 100%, that the windows in the named Application are going to go away. I believe in this case, the location of the Quit menu is a user preference (like click-to-front windows vs. window-to-front-on-hover) that simply just takes getting used to. That said, the proper place for it is in the App menu. You don't Quit a file, you close it. You Quit an App.
Thirdly, the App menu needs to stay in the upper left hand corner along with all the other App-related menus. Putting it in the upper right signifies to the user that the menus is unrelated to the current application, which is bad. I don't really have a suggestion for what should go in the upper right, except for maybe the time, and an Application Switcher.
Fourth, "File" should only have the functions regarding the currently selected File. These would be Close, Clone, Save, Save As, Print, etc. The current File->New menu item should probably be App->New File.
Finally, all applications on the dock should repeat its respective App menu in a contextual window. If it is a document, it should repeat the File menu. Edit should be called "Selection", "Preferences" should be under App, "File Preferences" should be under File (for prefs with File scope only). There should be a list of open document windows in App.
Whew.
Anyway, my $0.2. Nothing will probably ever come of my suggestions anyway -- just thought it had to be said
Mike
First, I like your ideas for the Apple menu. However, since this is a new interface and all, why not keep it the "Go" menu. "Go" is much more intuitive than an Apple in the corner. Go would be available in all apps, where the top portion (i.e. the stable, non-moving portion) would be system-wide links, and a subsection below that links specific to navigating the currently selected application.
Second, I disagree that Quit should be moved to the File menu. Yes, I'm use to it, and so is everyone else, and yes, I feel "uncomfortable" whenever I automatically open "File" and can't find it there. However, this level of uncomfortability actually HELPS in that when I do find Quit under the App menu, I absolute know, 100%, that the windows in the named Application are going to go away. I believe in this case, the location of the Quit menu is a user preference (like click-to-front windows vs. window-to-front-on-hover) that simply just takes getting used to. That said, the proper place for it is in the App menu. You don't Quit a file, you close it. You Quit an App.
Thirdly, the App menu needs to stay in the upper left hand corner along with all the other App-related menus. Putting it in the upper right signifies to the user that the menus is unrelated to the current application, which is bad. I don't really have a suggestion for what should go in the upper right, except for maybe the time, and an Application Switcher.
Fourth, "File" should only have the functions regarding the currently selected File. These would be Close, Clone, Save, Save As, Print, etc. The current File->New menu item should probably be App->New File.
Finally, all applications on the dock should repeat its respective App menu in a contextual window. If it is a document, it should repeat the File menu. Edit should be called "Selection", "Preferences" should be under App, "File Preferences" should be under File (for prefs with File scope only). There should be a list of open document windows in App.
Whew.
Anyway, my $0.2. Nothing will probably ever come of my suggestions anyway -- just thought it had to be said
Mike
zerorex
Registered
the butie of X is that the power user can set it up how ever he wants. There have been a few posts about how to make os X behave like os 9, and though I question why anyone would want to do this, it goes to show that it can be done. As for getting rid of the dock, if you move it out of the CoreServices folder and restart, it wont start up. In truth, the same should go for the Desktop.app. The point is that Apple has done something for the power users. They have made osX extreamly customizable. If you dont like the dock, make your own. By the final release, the interface should be very customizable, and you should be able to manage your work flows how ever you want. As for the apple menu, the last few builds that have been leaked, (4k46, 4k56, 4k60) have all had the apple menu.
As for the small details like where the "Quit" button should be, I dont think it really matters, as long as it is in the same place in all apps.
This really touches on the root of the whole point. We as users dont get to make decisions about where every menu item should be, or wether the apple menu should be on the left or right, or what color the box should be that os x ships in. We do get to expect consitancy. So the real argument here is wether or not OS X should be consistant with os 9, 8, 7, etc. Concidering that it is a whole new os from the ground up, I dont think it should. OS X takes a que from NeXTSTEP which is already seen in GNUStep/WindowMaker. That is a very minimalistic UI. With os 9, you can have your apps show up in many different places. They can be in the apple menu, on the desktop, and in the HD. This is a little redundant. If you take a little time to get fumilur with the dock, I think you will see that it can actually improve your work flow.
[Edited by zerorex on 02-26-2001 at 11:29 AM]
As for the small details like where the "Quit" button should be, I dont think it really matters, as long as it is in the same place in all apps.
This really touches on the root of the whole point. We as users dont get to make decisions about where every menu item should be, or wether the apple menu should be on the left or right, or what color the box should be that os x ships in. We do get to expect consitancy. So the real argument here is wether or not OS X should be consistant with os 9, 8, 7, etc. Concidering that it is a whole new os from the ground up, I dont think it should. OS X takes a que from NeXTSTEP which is already seen in GNUStep/WindowMaker. That is a very minimalistic UI. With os 9, you can have your apps show up in many different places. They can be in the apple menu, on the desktop, and in the HD. This is a little redundant. If you take a little time to get fumilur with the dock, I think you will see that it can actually improve your work flow.
[Edited by zerorex on 02-26-2001 at 11:29 AM]
Please go on page 2 of this thread and read the comments I had posted on the 15th of October 2000 :
http://www.macosx.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=915&pagenumber=2
My, my ! I feel as if Steve Jobs had read my post !
http://www.macosx.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=915&pagenumber=2
My, my ! I feel as if Steve Jobs had read my post !
jove
Member
Hello,
I just have to say that most of the complaints about X specified in this thread are knee-jerk-reactions. X is a different OS with a different mode of operation. It cannot be the bastardized OS we know and love called MacOS9.
Anyways Apple has addressed many of the listed concerns in the latest builds. Watch the streamed Stevenote.
Jove
I just have to say that most of the complaints about X specified in this thread are knee-jerk-reactions. X is a different OS with a different mode of operation. It cannot be the bastardized OS we know and love called MacOS9.
Anyways Apple has addressed many of the listed concerns in the latest builds. Watch the streamed Stevenote.
Jove
I don't know. In theory, I guess you can call this "extremely customizable" but what I consider customizable is something that can easily be changed. Yes I could program my own dock, and I suppose I could even program my own GUI, my own operating system to lie over Apple's kernel. But I won't. It would be a lot easier if Apple would just let you move the dock to the right side of the screen (a feature in post-public beta builds which has reportedly now been removed).
umm no. I'm an advanced user, i've been porting unix apps, developing in cocoa etc, and the dock is not simply for beginners.
I suggest to everyone who doesn't like the dock, force yourself to use it for a couple of days. I hated it at first, after the cuteness of it wore off but a couple of months ago I actually started using it and now OS 9 pisses my off because it _doesn't_ have a dock.
peter
