Mac under attack...

mata hari

Registered
' was wondering...
There is an obvious democratization of mac computers (in numbers of users)... especialy with their beautiful and popular laptops and now with the attractive mini mac.
But as the increase of mac users, may we expect an increase of virus, troyan and so on...? making the anti-virus market for mac more and more tempting...

will mac be "soon" attack by numerous evil progs as for pc's...
what you fellows think...?
:cool:
 
I think Mac is a UNIX variety and attacks on UNIX machines is lower, some say Windows having a larger share of the market means it is the major target of attacks, some however are just idiologically opposed to the dominance of Microsoft and attack them on principle, usually from other UNIX machines.

Nothing is immune to attack though.
 
I have the same worries- As the Mac population grows, the more of a target it will be to the people that make virus's. I think that the number of virus's on the Mac will never grow to the amount of virus's on the PC, because we all know that Windows has many more opportunities in it's system to send a virus through than OS X does. If this does become a problem, however, I trust that Apple will sort it out, making software or system updates that automatically protect us from all the crap thats out there.
 
HI

don't think so, the apple market share will remain small for quite some time Unless Windoze users throw out their "intel inside idiot outside" mean machines in a very large scale which I doubt. :eek: :eek:

I feel safe with OS X and not worried this should change
::angel::
 
Gig' said:
HI

don't think so, the apple market share will remain small for quite some time Unless Windoze users throw out their "intel inside idiot outside" mean machines in a very large scale which I doubt. :eek: :eek:

I feel safe with OS X and not worried this should change
::angel::

I agree. Marley fan eh? Macs make I and I feel irie.... ;-)
 
well...
i appreciate your optimism, but seeing all around me more and more poeple geting mac... shops having larger and larger room for mac products... i think to myself... money talks...

you may be right, this might not happen tomorrow... but how much time left, surely one day the mac security market will be big enough for private firms to make money, a lot of money.

But it's good and encouraging to see such optimism.
thanx,
any further opinion?
 
Yes, as the Macintosh grows, it will be more of a target. But Mac OS X is more stable, plus, it's Apple. They're good at updates, better than MS IMO.
 
Any 'attacks' to a Mac machine will be limited to the user who is logged on at the time of attack. Unix security is way more sandboxed than Windows. It's hard to whack a Unix system... of any flavor... if you're using a standard user account. If you're running around always logged on as a sysadmin or as *gasp* root, well, then... I guess you kinda get what's coming. :)
 
I would tend to agree with padishahemperor; those people who make and distribute viruses are users of Linux and Unix systems, and they are specifically targeting Windows because they don't like it. Apple, and their OS, have the respect of these people, and because of this, will be free for the most part from attacks. Then there's the fact that Apple doesn't use that stupid "security by obscurity" concept that seems to hold sway at Microsoft. We're safe, I think.
 
mbveau said:
I would tend to agree with padishahemperor; those people who make and distribute viruses are users of Linux and Unix systems, and they are specifically targeting Windows because they don't like it. Apple, and their OS, have the respect of these people, and because of this, will be free for the most part from attacks. Then there's the fact that Apple doesn't use that stupid "security by obscurity" concept that seems to hold sway at Microsoft. We're safe, I think.

Gotta love the FUD. Do you have any numbers or solid proof that Windows virus writers are Linux and Unix users?

Most Windows viruses are use some form of VBScript. Thanks to the great integration with the OS and VBScripts ease of use, that means many people can start writing viruses. Popular viruses like Melissa and ILoveYou are all written in VBScript. Since nothing apart from Windows has VBScript, I doubt *nix users were responsible.

Apple and their OS does *not* have the respect of the open sourced community. Contrary to what you think, many feel Apple to be worse than MS when it comes to monopolistic practices. Linux people also take Linus Trovald's stance on the BSD/Mach microkernel (which OS X uses) and what they say is not complimentary in the least. Whether their arguments are true, isn't important. Fact is, that is the impression the open sourced Linux people have of Apple. Envy of Apple's success, I guess.

That said, Apple will still have next to no viruses for the Mac platform. It uses the Unix security model, with access rights, and not every file is executable. A file can't just execute and write to places it's not allowed to. On Windows, you could easily write a program that deletes everything in c:\Windows\System32 (some files won't be deleted because they are in use. Most others will). On Unix systems, good luck trying to do a similar thing to /usr.

As chornbe has said, Macs aren't invulnerable. If you run as root all the time, you're asking for trouble.
 
Viro,

You make some excellent points. While I'm generally a fan of some of the *products* that come out of the open source movement (Linux is trez sweet for being free, Python is just fantastic, the Gimp, etc), I do not necessarily believe that the open source universe is the savior of computers and software everywhere. For the most part, open source products tend to be a generation.. in most cases, several generations... behind commercial software in polish, usability and "nice-ness".

Take the Windows GUI, Apple GUI and... oh... pretty much *any* free distro of *nux. I would consider it a pointless "debate" for anyone to suggest that anything from the free-world's X-11 offerings are "better" (meaning: more accpeted, user friendly and polished) than what Redmond and Cupertino offer. They simply aren't.

In terms of "hey, this works nice": Apple > Windows > free X11.
In terms of commercial acceptance: Windows > Apple > free X11.

The fight between Apple and Microsoft for "who has the better GUI?"... That's is simply a battle of money and marketing at this point. But the free X11 world simply isn't a contender.

Let me give you another real-world example that I recently came across.

My company, for reasons that are as yet unfathomable to me, develop all their enterprise wide systems in Perl with the occasional Java piece over a Sybase back end. They're a Sun shop. My team and I are a small, agile, hard-hitting team of quick-implementation, types. By career choices and timing, most of us are Microsoft based programmers; my focus being C# for over 3 years now. (I've been there 6 years and still can't figure out why they hired me... Anyone hiring? :) )

I wrote a bunch of standardized, soap-based web services for an up and coming set of functionality that my team supports. Everyone was consuming it just fine... Except Perl callers. You see, there's a bug in Perl where they hard coded the names of XML namespaces in the Soap::Lite package. So, Perl is capable of consuming only a very limited subset of all the soap offerings out there and nearly nothing that microsoft's tools create. The Perl gangs all suggest you mangle your WSDL to "fix" the name spaces that the Microsoft tool kits create, even tho' *every* other Soap client out there works fine. Declarative name spaces are, after all, a known XML standard and *should* be universally implemented.

I say, "fix perl". The retort? you'll love this... I hear it all the time...

"It's open source. You can fix it if you want."

(sigh)
 
theres a competition run every year, with a prize stake of $13,000 for anyone who can hack into the MacOSX kernal. it's never been won yet....

macOS is built solid, and built secure - there arent any virus' yet for MacOS x. there;s a couple of hundred for <8.5-9.2 but thats it. at the moment all we can do it pass virus's on.
 
chornbe said:
Take the Windows GUI, Apple GUI and... oh... pretty much *any* free distro of *nux. I would consider it a pointless "debate" for anyone to suggest that anything from the free-world's X-11 offerings are "better" (meaning: more accpeted, user friendly and polished) than what Redmond and Cupertino offer. They simply aren't.

In terms of "hey, this works nice": Apple > Windows > free X11.
In terms of commercial acceptance: Windows > Apple > free X11.

(sigh)

I think this used to be the case. Right now, GNOME is IMHO a very very viable competitor to the OS X interface. It's clean, intuitive and just very well integrated. Just like the OS X. Which is probably why distros using GNOME are making inroads into corporations. It's nicer than Windows, cheaper to maintain than OS X and runs on existing machines. I have to say though, anything prior to GNOME 2.8 really sucked in my eyes, so if you tried GNOME before 2.8 was released, give it a try again. You may like what you see. I like it so much that it's making me doubt the upgrade to Tiger. Honestly, no kidding ;).

All the other free environments like KDE are ... a usability nightmare in my book. KDE is overly complex (look at that control panel...), and the rest just aren't as fully fledged as OS X, Windows or GNOME.
 
mbveau said:
Viro; touche, I'll do my research next time. What's a FUD?

After reading my previous post, it sounded a touch aggressive. Sorry about that. Blame it on me just waking up :D.
 
Viro said:
I think this used to be the case. Right now, GNOME is IMHO a very very viable competitor to the OS X interface. It's clean, intuitive and just very well integrated. Just like the OS X. Which is probably why distros using GNOME are making inroads into corporations. It's nicer than Windows, cheaper to maintain than OS X and runs on existing machines. I have to say though, anything prior to GNOME 2.8 really sucked in my eyes, so if you tried GNOME before 2.8 was released, give it a try again. You may like what you see. I like it so much that it's making me doubt the upgrade to Tiger. Honestly, no kidding ;).

All the other free environments like KDE are ... a usability nightmare in my book. KDE is overly complex (look at that control panel...), and the rest just aren't as fully fledged as OS X, Windows or GNOME.

*nods* you make a good point. I honestly have no idea what version of Gnome I'm using on my Fedora box. I should check that out.

But I still think that Apple and Windows just has a more polished look than most things X11.

And, less pure-GUI in nature, they have way better look&feel and end-user-peripheral support, too. I have no doubt that in a corporate environment where you have tight controls and (usually) a pretty militaristic approach to systems management, Linux could certainly flourish. It's still years and years away from being viable in the home market, tho'. The time is *now* for Apple to make their move. I don't think they could achieve #1 (yet, if [sadly] ever), but they could gain #2 by a HUGE margin over all other competitors for all time if they act now, act smart and act decisively.

Just as a good, commercially backed and well-funded Linux distro could.

I believe things like XP sp2, too many windows version, Media Center pricing and licensing, the stupid registration model, etc., has Redmond in probably the most vulnerable position they've ever been in.

I point this out being a 15+ year user of Microsoft products, a MS-oriented developer and general non-hater of Redmond.

$.02
 
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