There's an interesting article in the new issue of Money magazine regarding Apple's financial situation/market share. It mentions how in 1996 Jobs turned the company around, from a year of loss to a year of gain ($600 million). The writer also mentions the release of the iPod mini, and that many people in line at the Soho store the day of its release were PC users. He said that only person he had talked to switched to Mac because of the iPod. I'm just curious, what is everyone's opinion as to why Apple has such a small market share? We have OS X, the most sophisticated OS to date, yet Apple's market share has dropped since the days of OS 9. The iPod and iTunes, both of which are available to PC users, show what an innovative company Apple is, and the ease of use of their hardware and software. Even the government is seriously contemplating switching to Mac. Most likely it's the cost. People like saving money, and most people are going to choose the $600 PC over the $1200 iMac. Also, I think Apple needs to do more marketing if they ever want to go places. Apple is a computer and software company, not a MP3 player company. If they made as many commercials showing off OS X as they do for the iPod, I think they'd see results. Well, that's just my opinion ...
Money April 2004: Why iPod Can't Save Apple
- Thread starter bjurusik
- Start date
Krevinek
Evil PPC Tweaker
bjurusik said:
There is cost, but that isn't the total calculation of market share. Market share is based on yearly sales. Even if Apple is selling more and more units per year, if the overall units sold per year increases faster than Apple's increases, then the market share for Apple shrinks. Plus, there are issues with how many machines someone is likely to buy new from Apple compared to Dell/etc (which is due to cost/etc). All these factors have an effect on market share.
Keep in mind that Market share is not based on existing machines, but rather machines sold during a year compared to the total machines sold during a year... 'shrinking' market share isn't specifically a bad thing. Apple bleeding red ink like crazy again is a bad thing.
Ripcord
Senior Lurker
I think mostly it's cost and ignorance, personally. When most people I talk to that vehemently hate Macs or are indifferent sit down and actually spend a couple of hours exploring them and learning about the plus sides, they tend to fall in love. However, most people (at least Americans, in my experience) seem to like bargains and quantity vs quality, so if they feel like they've been able to get a "good deal" by buying that Dell system for $900 instead of that Apple system for $1800, they're very pleased with themselves (and seem to think about what they've done when they're struggling to install a scanner or do some simple work with photos).
The state of software and web browsing is also a real concern - there just aren't many good apps in a lot of areas, and too many websites that are *still* incompatible/broken with standards-based browsers.
However, I don't think it's just people being "cheap" or misunderstanding the Mac, I think the price chasm is waaaay too wide. The gap starts to narrow as you move towards the upper-end of the market, but especially in the middle and lower ends the product line is a bit thin and the price gap is terrible - Entry to mid-range macs tend to cost 2-3 TIMES a comparably-specced PC. That's enough to give just about anyone pause, even IF they understand the advantages of the Mac.
The state of corporate support is terrible and Apple really isn't doing a very good job of pursuing it, so it's virtually nonexistant in most Enterprise shops, where a lot of the big bucks are to be found.
The state of software and web browsing is also a real concern - there just aren't many good apps in a lot of areas, and too many websites that are *still* incompatible/broken with standards-based browsers.
However, I don't think it's just people being "cheap" or misunderstanding the Mac, I think the price chasm is waaaay too wide. The gap starts to narrow as you move towards the upper-end of the market, but especially in the middle and lower ends the product line is a bit thin and the price gap is terrible - Entry to mid-range macs tend to cost 2-3 TIMES a comparably-specced PC. That's enough to give just about anyone pause, even IF they understand the advantages of the Mac.
The state of corporate support is terrible and Apple really isn't doing a very good job of pursuing it, so it's virtually nonexistant in most Enterprise shops, where a lot of the big bucks are to be found.
I think Apple is destined to an eternity of low market share. I don't see any way of digging out of it. But I also don't see that as being automatically meaning doom for Apple. Sure, I'd love Apple to start chipping away at market share, just like all of us, but what is just as important is profitability, which they have delivered in spades recently (last few years).
Yeah, 2% market share is frightfully low, but nonetheless it still represents millions of dedicated users, most of which will give up their Macs when they are pried from their cold, dead fingers. Apple is very strong in niche areas, which helps a lot.
But to answer the question, why is Apple's market share so low, we'd first have to go back twenty years when Apple (actually it was mostly Jean-Louis Gasse) had a choice to make..market share or profit margin. They chose profit margin and their shareholders were quite happy. So nearsighted.
So when customers are faced with good but expensive, or good enough and cheap, they generally choose good enough. The classic VHS versus Betamax is always the great example that comes up, and it's a good one. VHS was good enough, and more importantly, it was good enough in quantity.
If there's anything I've learned from this mess it's that the number one goal in technology development should be to get your product to the masses. I fear Apple is on the verge of making the same old mistake with the iPod. Yeah, they're selling great now, but Steve himself has said it's all about profit margin on those iPods. That's great for shareholders and quickfix money boost, but what about five years from now when a ten dollar Dell iPod that's good enough exists? And it's not iTunes compatible. I would think it would be Apple's best interest to get as many iPods on the planet, whatever it takes. But now I'm getting off track.
The other reason Apple's market share is low and has no hope of changing is in general business arenas like banks, hospitals, offices w/ large numbers of employees, etc. It's just too big an investment to switch over an entire infrastructure. Or too big a cultural change if nothing else. And as much as I freaking hate M$ and Windows, you can actually get work done on the things if you have to. There would have to be a compelling reason to switch and an office of, heh, Office users has no partiicular need to switch. It's not like they're editing video, managing music/photos, or looking for the subtleties of a refined OS all day.
And then there's the gamers. I think it's no exaggeration to say that if Apple could drop ten million dollars on R&D for a KILLER game (Mac only of course), you'd see a few percentage points switch. That gamer crowd is like the NRA man, there's just no compromise in those people. They'll drop a thousand bucks to get ten more FPS that they can't even notice. They're insane, god luv em.
Yeah, 2% market share is frightfully low, but nonetheless it still represents millions of dedicated users, most of which will give up their Macs when they are pried from their cold, dead fingers. Apple is very strong in niche areas, which helps a lot.
But to answer the question, why is Apple's market share so low, we'd first have to go back twenty years when Apple (actually it was mostly Jean-Louis Gasse) had a choice to make..market share or profit margin. They chose profit margin and their shareholders were quite happy. So nearsighted.
So when customers are faced with good but expensive, or good enough and cheap, they generally choose good enough. The classic VHS versus Betamax is always the great example that comes up, and it's a good one. VHS was good enough, and more importantly, it was good enough in quantity.
If there's anything I've learned from this mess it's that the number one goal in technology development should be to get your product to the masses. I fear Apple is on the verge of making the same old mistake with the iPod. Yeah, they're selling great now, but Steve himself has said it's all about profit margin on those iPods. That's great for shareholders and quickfix money boost, but what about five years from now when a ten dollar Dell iPod that's good enough exists? And it's not iTunes compatible. I would think it would be Apple's best interest to get as many iPods on the planet, whatever it takes. But now I'm getting off track.
The other reason Apple's market share is low and has no hope of changing is in general business arenas like banks, hospitals, offices w/ large numbers of employees, etc. It's just too big an investment to switch over an entire infrastructure. Or too big a cultural change if nothing else. And as much as I freaking hate M$ and Windows, you can actually get work done on the things if you have to. There would have to be a compelling reason to switch and an office of, heh, Office users has no partiicular need to switch. It's not like they're editing video, managing music/photos, or looking for the subtleties of a refined OS all day.
And then there's the gamers. I think it's no exaggeration to say that if Apple could drop ten million dollars on R&D for a KILLER game (Mac only of course), you'd see a few percentage points switch. That gamer crowd is like the NRA man, there's just no compromise in those people. They'll drop a thousand bucks to get ten more FPS that they can't even notice. They're insane, god luv em.
There's a bunch of reasons...
First, too much money for most people. They can get a 'nice' system from Dell with a 15" LCD for $699 at times on specials. Now, we all know that system is low end but to them it does what they need. The closest thing Apple offers would be an iMac at around 2x that price.
Over the past 5 years PCs have seen huge drops in prices, while Macs have seen very small ones.
$1299 -- 15" iMac 1ghz g4 256mb ram 80gb HD combo (cdr/rw dvd rom)
$1027 -- Dimension 2400 2.66ghz P4 256mb ram 80gb HD combo (cdr/rw dvd rom) 15" flat panel
In actuality a 25% drop on the whole line could make a difference, but that can't happen while they're at such a low volume.
Second, most still have a skewed view on Apple products. They're looked at as incompatible. Almost every single person I meet has this view. Apple needs to figure out a way to change those opinions.
First, too much money for most people. They can get a 'nice' system from Dell with a 15" LCD for $699 at times on specials. Now, we all know that system is low end but to them it does what they need. The closest thing Apple offers would be an iMac at around 2x that price.
Over the past 5 years PCs have seen huge drops in prices, while Macs have seen very small ones.
$1299 -- 15" iMac 1ghz g4 256mb ram 80gb HD combo (cdr/rw dvd rom)
$1027 -- Dimension 2400 2.66ghz P4 256mb ram 80gb HD combo (cdr/rw dvd rom) 15" flat panel
In actuality a 25% drop on the whole line could make a difference, but that can't happen while they're at such a low volume.
Second, most still have a skewed view on Apple products. They're looked at as incompatible. Almost every single person I meet has this view. Apple needs to figure out a way to change those opinions.
speedfreak
Registered
Apple needs to be saved from what?
jonmichael23
Registered
I have always been suspicious as to what Apple is thinking when it comes to advertising. Even the iPod commercials, don't actually show the "real" product, its menu, or why its so easy to use (touch wheel). Dell is constantly pumping out new commercials for the same computer and laptops every 2-3 months. I want to see some Panther commercials, showing off what the operating systems all about. I want to see some G5 commercials. And I don't want them to air for about a week and a half and never be seen again. I know chiat-day does the advertising but even so why doesn't apple tell them to start making these kind of commercials. Also, the money difference is what keeps Apple down. You think it takes as much to make a stupid emachines or dell PC in contrast to an iMac, eMac, etc. Most likely not, and the fact that Macs are typically more ( your getting your money's worth, not something you'll end up hating after a month or two). Oh well, I know Apple will stay around they always seem to hang in there, and hopefully we'll see some more people starting to look at Apple.
speedfreak
Registered
They could make a cheap headless mac IF they wanted to. I'd buy an ugly cheap headless mac. This is what I want in a cheap mac.
2ghz G5 - 512MB - 30GB - 64MB vid w/vga - cdrw/dvdrom 4 FW and 4 USB 2.0 ports ethernet - -modem -
$500 - 750 max
They could do this no problem.
Will they? Not likely!!
2ghz G5 - 512MB - 30GB - 64MB vid w/vga - cdrw/dvdrom 4 FW and 4 USB 2.0 ports ethernet - -modem -
$500 - 750 max
They could do this no problem.
Will they? Not likely!!
soulseek
It's set to groove
the thing with apple products is that apart from the design.. (which is very important.. try opening a pc box... and then compare it to a mac..) ... apple products also have good quality...
u can buy an Acer or Fujitsu laptop for 1300 euros... instead of a powerbook for 2000-2500 euros.... but the thing with the apple is that the latptop is very light, small, good quality etc.... and that is why if u wanna buy a Sony Vaio laptop ull find urself spending at least 2000 euros
u can buy an Acer or Fujitsu laptop for 1300 euros... instead of a powerbook for 2000-2500 euros.... but the thing with the apple is that the latptop is very light, small, good quality etc.... and that is why if u wanna buy a Sony Vaio laptop ull find urself spending at least 2000 euros
Randman
HA! HA! HA!
Part of it is pc people tend to come into 2 types: those who just want it as easy as they can get it and those who like to tinker. For those who like to tinker, a pc is probably a better way to go as it's easier to modify/upgrade.
Now you'd think the person who doesn't like their computers too technical would love a Mac. And many do. But too many are under the impression that it's an alien operating system from what they know about pcs and they are afraid of making a switch and having to learn everything all over again.
That's what the advertising should address. The form factor is one thing. The ease and quality of the work is another.
Now you'd think the person who doesn't like their computers too technical would love a Mac. And many do. But too many are under the impression that it's an alien operating system from what they know about pcs and they are afraid of making a switch and having to learn everything all over again.
That's what the advertising should address. The form factor is one thing. The ease and quality of the work is another.
MDLarson
Registered
As long as Apple puts out a good product that satisfies what I want to do on a computer, I won't care about market share. There's too much Mac software out there for me to notice the lack of Mac software, if you understand me.
Don't get me wrong; I think market share is important for the big picture, but it just doesn't affect me. I can still do anything I want on a Mac that I would on a PC.
Don't get me wrong; I think market share is important for the big picture, but it just doesn't affect me. I can still do anything I want on a Mac that I would on a PC.
Krevinek
Evil PPC Tweaker
speedfreak said:
There would have to be some sacrifices to achieve that... such as no Gigabit ethernet, the video card would be older hardware, the FW/USB would be semi-crippled compared to current machines. (Apple's machines actually assign a bus to each port for USB, and might do the same for Firewire) And the modem wouldn't be there, as the only truly 'cheap' modems are Winmodems. 512MB RAM probably wouldn't be in there either, and you would be looking at a G4 chip, not a G5.
To get in the 500-750$ range, you have to make a fair number of sacrifices in design, and make assumptions on how they are going to be used. I could see Apple able to make a G4 version of what you are talking about for 800-900$.. but not in the 500-750$ range. PPC chips aren't high volume enough for prices THAT low.
One of the reason Apple is not increasing it's market share is the fact that the hardware last much longer. Try running Quark, Photoshop or Window XP on a 400 mhz Pentium. When you buy a Mac you know that you will not have to upgrade for at least a couple of year. A cheap PC will be outdated much faster.
Quicksilver
Find a golden apple.
Well i think it has alot to do with advertising. come on the hardware looks great but how much have you seen apple really promote OS X the operating system, yes the one with the fantastic colors and graphical features.
People may get enlightened in by the hardware but when it comes to clicking the buttons they may be getting a little confusion with transfering the knowledge of windows os user interface to a new concept. I guess it like driving a european car where the wiper and blinker controls are on the opposite sides thus when you turn a corner to blink your window wipers frantricly wipe a dry window and you look like a bloody ediot.
To a consumer windows user this is incredibly frustrating and then they give up.
As i said before OS X needs to be promoted more as a alternative "operating system" and i bet then for sure you will see people switch. c'mon its common sence.
People may get enlightened in by the hardware but when it comes to clicking the buttons they may be getting a little confusion with transfering the knowledge of windows os user interface to a new concept. I guess it like driving a european car where the wiper and blinker controls are on the opposite sides thus when you turn a corner to blink your window wipers frantricly wipe a dry window and you look like a bloody ediot.
To a consumer windows user this is incredibly frustrating and then they give up.
As i said before OS X needs to be promoted more as a alternative "operating system" and i bet then for sure you will see people switch. c'mon its common sence.