OSX 10.04 - 10.1 Patch... Why not?

sallamud

Registered
People are talking about not being able to download OSX 10.1 from Apple due to bandwidth issues... and mentioning a file size upwards of 550 megs.

I had assumed that the FREE upgrade Apple would make available on their site would be a PATCH, that is, something with a file size less than 80 megs or so.

Why should we be thinking otherwise?

Remember, the builds that people are pulling down from Carracho have been full installs, not upgrades. So, of course the file sizes are massive.

And of course, Apple would NEVER have a >500meg file available for general download on their site.

But Steve DID say FREE, did he not? Surely there will be an upgrade patch (smaller file size) recognizable by OSX's "software update" utility on Apple's website by the end of the month. I ask again: Why should we be thinking otherwise?

Just curious.
 

simX

Unofficial Mac Genius
The update itself is a couple hundred megs. The tweaks we're talking about here is of a MAJOR update. I wouldn't be surprised if every thing has been overhauled in the system, and that not a single file has remained the same, making the update 500 MB.

Also, when Steve said "free", there was a HUGE SCREEN in back of him saying that there would be a $19.95 S&H cost for mailing the update, since it won't be downloadable. Evidently some people take words too literally.

Furthermore, Apple has confirmed that you can get the update package free from Apple retail stores, and select Apple Authorized Resellers, although the list of resellers has not been named.

-- simX
 

sallamud

Registered
strange... so the release of OSX earlier in the year (before it was really finished) was some sort of marketing thing. we paid money to be beta testers. i'm sure the early release has helped to get developers moving, but it's still a sham.

i have to say, though i despise microsoft, they would never, ever put out such a crippled gimp of an OS, call it "finished", only to release a complete overhaul within the year.

i'm a die-hard apple fan, so please, no flames on that one.
 

a2daj

Registered
You're right about the developers. How many companies do you think would have bothered releasing OS X applications if OS X wasn't officially launched last March? How else would Apple have convinced developers to get in gear and release apps? Apple also mentioned many times that the initial OS X launch was geared toward early adopters. Although OS X is installed on all Macs sold these days, Mac OS Classic is still the default system. I've talked to a number of people that never realized their computers came with OS X. So it's not like Apple is constantly force feeding OS X down people's throats.
I'm also sure Apple was looking to get back some money for the development for the new OS.
IIRC, the Windows OSes have had issues with them when they were released. And the services packs have been known to be rather large...
And, are OSes really ever 'finished?'
 

WoLF

For President
the 5G59 build is 650 megs

I actually don't care too much of what it is. I have many friends with access to whatever type of outcome it will be (cd, download, etc). But carracho has been great to me and my server (hosted on t1 ;) )

If it were my decision and I were SJ, I would make it a cd that you can burn at a apple store, or one you can buy online (more/less of what they have of 10.0 right now in stores and stuff) As for the burn at a apple store, I've been hearing and thinking about bringing media to a Local apple store and have them burn it for you. They do have 24x CD-Rs you know :p
It would be fast too and good popularity for the store
 

rhale1

KU Mac Geek
You would need those coupons that came with OS X, right?
 

AdmiralAK

Simply Daemonic
WoLF from WoLF's den ??? lol :p
Tried getting G59 today but kpt getting disconnected dammin! :p

I actually started downloading, server disconned me, got in queue again at slot #3...got disconnected again...then back in que a few seconds later at slot #10 (or what ever )...that was frustrating :p


Admiral
 

sallamud

Registered
>And, are OSes really ever 'finished?' (a2daj)

too true.

i guess i'm just really surprised to see a point release ~600megs.

also, what's with $19.95 for S&H for a CD?

I can order a music CD and have it delivered for less than that.

Registered owners (ahem, beta testers) of OSX should receive their upgrades free of charge via media mail. Sure, it takes a bit longer, but we've waited this long anyway... Besides, no professional (designer) would be using OSX 10.1 exclusively ANYWAY until the apps are there, so waiting shouldn't matter.

I'm basically going to shell out $20 to get my usable OS, which as of yet has none of the apps that I need to do my job, putting me exactly where I was a year ago with OSX. WAITING... oh golly, now the finder is so FAST!!! ;)

sorry, i know i'm getting sarcastic. i honestly am very excited about the future... i'm just tired of waiting. a year from now, i'll never have to look at OS9 again... (i keep repeating to myself)
 

sallamud

Registered
>You would need those coupons that came with OS X, right?
(rhale1)

coupons? i don't recall any coupons... were they in the OSX box from the March release?
 

Red Phoenix

Registered
I would still doubt that the X.I release will fill up a whole CD (although if they include updated Developer Tools and also a copy of the installer of OS 9.2.1, this would of course change things). I think that there are many possible arguments as to whether OS X. is a beta OS or just really rough around the edges. Personally, I have found it to be plenty usable (the stability makes up for it being a bit slower, although I am a little disturbed that Internet Explorer in Classic mode is faster than any of the OS X native browsers have.) Graphics professions and desktop layout people have no programs yet, and so it's useless for them for now. The thing is, OS X would be useless for them now if it were only just coming out.

Personally, I'm hoping that Apple will realize that asking people to pay $20 for the shipping and handling of a copy of a .I release is unreasonable. If, on the other hand, I have no other recourse but to shell out $20 within a week or two, I'll probably be posting another message here complaining myself. But for now, I'll wait...

P.S. I don't remember any coupons, either. If they leave it up in the air how we can prove that we have bought it, and I can get it at the Apple store, I'll just bring in the whole box as proof.
 

AdmiralAK

Simply Daemonic
so should I drive to the apple store and request the upgrade CD (free of course...or maybe free if I bring my own CD-R with me :p) ?????


Admiral
PS: over 1400 post ;) Can I make it 2002 by Jan, 1, 2002 ? ;)
 

simX

Unofficial Mac Genius
[FLAME] (stupid board thinking them as REAL HTML tags.)

First: If you bought the public beta of OS X, you got a $30 DISCOUNT off the initial release of OS X. You're right, you paid money to become a beta tester: 2 CENTS.

Second: The update is probably going to be the OS X 10.1 CD, the OS 9.2.1 CD, and an updated Dev Tools CD, as well as a manual highlighting the new features and showing how to do it. This justifies the $20 S&H.

Third: You CAN go to the Apple Store and request a copy of MacOS X 10.1 for free, as long as you have your Mac OS X 10.0 proof of purchase coupons. There were 3 that came with Mac OS X. These are designed for updates like this. You will also be able, according to the WSJ, be able to get the update for free at certain Apple Authorized Resellers.

Fourth: Apple has certainly NOT forced OS X down through your throats. If you think it's incomplete, why did you buy it? It's your problem. And it is not beta software.. it just lacks things you have taken advantage of up to now.

[/FLAME] :D
 

sallamud

Registered
>First: If you bought the public beta of OS X

I didn't. Why would I purchase a beta (knowingly)? I purchased the official release, which was so slow that I immediately switched back to 9.1, like most professional mac users. I honestly didn't expect more, though I had hoped to be surprised. Pretty interface though. Nice and stable. Slow as sh*t. It'll be great in a year, I thought.

>Second: 3 CD's and a manual geared towards complete newbies. This justifies the $20 S&H.

S&H means "Shipping and Handling," not "overhead." If I can get the exact same stuff for free at the Apple store, then I'm paying $20 for them to "mail" it to me. Last time I checked, over $3 is too much to mail a couple of CD's.

>Third: Mac OS X 10.0 proof of purchase coupons

Yep. Now I recall those three little cards... Didn't they read: "This version of OSX really sucks. It's pretty, but don't bother trying to use it for anything other than tinkering and impressing your PC friends. In six months or so, we'll have worked out most of the bugs (with your input). When that happens, risk your life by driving your car to one of our stores to get a functional copy. We promise that by then it will be almost as quick as our old OS, which, by-the-way, would've been just fine had we added protected memory."

I recall getting worried that there were three of them... Before installing, I thought: "What am I doing even putting this on my machine? Tinkering? Previewing? This is going to be almost as productive as downloading midget porn. Nicer to look at, though."

>Fourth: Apple has certainly NOT forced OS X down through your throats. If you think it's incomplete, why did you buy it? It's your problem. And it is not beta software.. it just lacks things you have taken advantage of up to now.

It was advertised as complete, and I like new stuff. That's why I bought it, though I knew that I wouldn't be using it exclusively until the apps were there. The manual was incomplete (undisputed), and "classic" is a joke for doing any kind of professional work. Really... it's like windoze booting into dos to get to an app that looks like a dos app inside of windoze. downright dorky. how many steps can we add to something that was once simple?

ALL OF THIS IS MOOT as soon as 10.1 is out and the fresh new apps are released. so please, don't get my panties in a wad. i'm all itchy as it is.
 

AdmiralAK

Simply Daemonic
I dont hold on to anything except for the CD after 25days lol...

The receipt, box, papers that came with the CD go into the recycling bin :p (Oh man I became a tree hugger ??? scott!!! you canuck! what have u done to us ??? :p lol )



Admiral
 

Red Phoenix

Registered
I don't think anyone here really needed a flaming...yet. It's more of a questions of how much money are we going to have to spend when X.I comes out. I personally believe we won't have to spend anything other than the cost of a CD-R, after talking with someone at the nearby Apple retail store. However, I'm not going to take that as fact until it gets released.

As for getting 3 CDs for $20, yeah, it's worth it, if that's what people were paying for. But it's shipping that people are supposed to be paying for, and $20 is a little on the high end. Who knows? Maybe Apple with have every copy of OS X.I hand-delivered by Robin Williams. Then I could see it costing that much to ship it. It would take a long time, but it'd be worth $20.
 

Red Phoenix

Registered
In Apple's defense, they haven't really advertised OS X yet. So I'm not sure one could claim that they advertised it as feature complete.
 

simX

Unofficial Mac Genius
Apple certainly DID NOT, I repeat, it DID NOT advertise Mac OS X as feature complete. You show me where they did that. Apple publicly acknowledged that there was no DVD player and that there was no built-in CD burning out of the box. They were putting it for the EARLY ADOPTERS who actually wanted to try and test it out.

It was your fault for misinterpreting the "advertising" by Apple.
 
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