Simple Mac to PC networking - not so simple

C

CaptainHM

Registered
I am at my wits' end. Please bear in mind that I am computer literate, but only at a fairly basic level. I'm likely to struggle if advice isn't very step-by-step. OK...

All I want to do is transfer files from my old Mac G4 (running OS 9) to my new (ish) PC (running Windows XP). I have a crossover ethernet cable which I understand should be enough on its own. I do not want to spend any more money.

From browsing forums such as this one I have gathered that there should be several different ways of networking these two computers but so far I have managed to make none of them succeed fully.

However, yesterday I managed to gain access to the Mac from the PC using Web Sharing on the Mac. This didn't seem to be the best way, but it would do. I was happy.

But then today I try to do exactly the same thing again and I get asked for a username and password. The Web Sharing settings on the Mac don't even ask me to supply a password and I don't have it set to Use File Sharing to control user access. I tried my Owner username and password on the Mac anyway. Didn't work. Tried creating new user accounts on the Mac and using their passwords. Didn't work. Tried removing the passwords from all the user accounts on the Mac. None of them worked. Why? Why is it doing this to me? WHY?

So maybe I should go back to the proper networking method. But I had even less progress with that. Neither computer seems able to see any trace of the other, despite my trying every piece of advice I could find (and understand). I've run Network Setup Wizard a billion times on the PC, I've given each machine an IP address according to instructions found I don't remember where. I'm very confused and very angry and on the verge of getting a USB flash drive. But I don't want to more out of principle than anything else.

Can anyone help?
 
Unfortunately, Mac OS 9 and below can't share files with Windows computers unless you use a software called DAVE from Thursby Software.

All by itself, Mac OS 9 and below can only share files using AppleTalk, while Windows PCs use Server Message Block, or SMB. Mac OS X 10.2 and up use a software package called Samba that makes Windows computers think that the non-Windows computer is in fact a Windows PC by using SMB to share files. Most open source Linux/UNIX distributions also come with Samba.

What i believe DAVE does is allow the Mac OS to use SMB in order to communicate with the Windows Pc for file sharing purposes. Unfortunately, it's not free but it's an option for your OS 9 Mac.

If you are going to use a USB thumbdrive, it's recommended that you format it MSDOS (or FAT16) so that it's visible under Windows and Mac OS 9. OS 9 won't recognize and NTFS-formatted device, and while OS X will recognize NTFS-formatted devices the access to them will be read-only.
 
CaptainHM said:
I just followed the instructions in this thread...

http://www.macosx.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42847

And the pinging appeared to be successful. It said something about sending 4 packets and them all returning without getting lost. That's good, right?

They still can't see each other though.
Click to expand...

TCP/IP is supported and has been since the early days of System 6, but they won't be able to share files unless you use DAVE.

The other option is to setup an FTP connection using an FTP server package. NetPresenz is a standalone FTP and HTTP server for Mac OS 9 and below that works quite well (I use it on my old Quadra 650). Of course, this would require and FTP client program on the PC. However, since you're running Windows XP, you can set up a Network Folder in My Network places to FTP into the Mac running NetPresenz. Just make sure that you don't exceed Mac OS 9's 32-character limit when you add files from your Windows XP computer to the Mac through FTP since it can make the file inaccessible (the dot and extension also counts as part of the character count if you're saving PC files there).
 
OK, so I'm wasting my time trying to network them conventionally unless I get DAVE (or OSX)?

Any idea what happened with the Web Sharing though? Why's it asking for a username and password when it didn't yesterday?

Thanks for the quick reply, by the way.
 
See my above post regarding FTP as a solution.

As for the Web Sharing problem, I'm guessing that since you have to share the Macintosh HD to do Web Sharing, the Mac OS is requiring a username and password that's set in the File Sharing control panel in Macintosh HD-->System Folder-->Control Panels. You can go there and change it if need be from the Mac itself.
 
Regarding the FTP thing - I'm a little lost. But just a little.

Would that require both machines to be online (as in on the internet)? Or would they actually still just be connected through the crossover cable and just kinda acting as if they were connecting across the 'net.

Do you see yet how I'm so near, yet so far, from understanding computers?
 
nixgeek said:
See my above post regarding FTP as a solution.

As for the Web Sharing problem, I'm guessing that since you have to share the Macintosh HD to do Web Sharing, the Mac OS is requiring a username and password that's set in the File Sharing control panel in Macintosh HD-->System Folder-->Control Panels. You can go there and change it if need be from the Mac itself.
Click to expand...

Been there. Tried that.

Like I said in my opening post, there seems to be an option in the Web Sharing control panel to choose whether or not to use File Sharing settings. I have it turned off. I tried turning it on yesterday ad it wouldn't let me access from the PC period. Didn't ask for a password or anything - just said I wasn't authorised. Turned it back off and I had access again. But that was yesterday. It's only today that it's started asking for the login details and it doesn't seem to be the File Sharing details because I've tried them and tried changing them.
 
Regarding the FTP thing - I'm a little lost. But just a little.

Would that require both machines to be online (as in on the internet)? Or would they actually still just be connected through the crossover cable and just kinda acting as if they were connecting across the 'net.
Click to expand...


No, it would be internally through the use of a crossover cable or a network switch/hub. you would just have to set the IP address statically on both machines (Ex: 192.168.1.2 on the Mac, and 192.168.1.3 on the PC, subnet mask 255.255.255.0 on both).

NetPresenz can be found here, but this would require your Mac to be on the Internet to download it since it's a .sit Stuffit compressed file and not .sit.hqx for download on PCs.
 
That's OK. I just cancelled the dial-up connection I had for the Mac, but it'll still be active for a couple more weeks. The file's only 700k, so that's no problem. Thanks very much. I shall report back with either joyous success or yet more agony.
 
:) OK...hope it all turns out fine.

BTW, as for the Web Sharing, you've got me on that one since I've never used it. :rolleyes:
 
nixgeek said:
The other option is to setup an FTP connection using an FTP server package. NetPresenz is a standalone FTP and HTTP server for Mac OS 9 and below that works quite well (I use it on my old Quadra 650). Of course, this would require and FTP client program on the PC. However, since you're running Windows XP, you can set up a Network Folder in My Network places to FTP into the Mac running NetPresenz.
Click to expand...

OK, so I've downloaded NetPresenz and it is running on my Mac. Whether it's set up correctly I don't know. I tried to set up a network folder in My Network Places, but it won't connect. Maybe I did it wrong. I set it to ftp://192.168.1.10 (I set my Mac to that IP address when I followed the instructions on the other thread). I also downloaded SmartFTP Client, but I don't even know where to begin with that. I have used FTP client software before (Fetch and one other I don't remember) but that's not really helping.

Any more advice?
 
OK, are you using a username to log in to the Mac or do you have it set for anonymous FTP? Try setting the username (and possibly a password if necessary).

Also remember that you might have to redo the Network Place. Also, if you set a password you might have to go to File-->Login As... after you create the Network Place in order for it to work with the password if you set one up.
 
I couldn't make it work either. My son is a geek doing network support for a living. He recommended "Dave" from Thursby Software. It did the job for me. I have a G4-Laptop as my main central computer, as well as a couple of other Macs in other locations in my house, all on an ethernet network. I also have a couple of remote PC's in my observatory about 300 feet from the house. I put a buried ethernet cable connecting them to the home network. I had to use PC's in the observatory because the software which runs my telescopes and CCD cameras only runs on PC's. When I hooked it all up, the PC's talked to each other and the Macs talked to each other but no communications were happening across the PC/Mac divide. I bought and installed Dave on the Laptop and now it is a member of the MSHOME workgroup I set up for the PC's in the observatory. I can take astrophotos with the CCD's and PC's out in the observatory and then download them to my G4-Laptop for further processing using Photoshop. Works fine, but only for the laptop running Dave. The other macs and the PC's still don't speak.
 
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