Where is the vaunted OSX stability?

N

neuby

Registered
I keep reading about how OSX 'never crashes'. May need a logout etc. to fix problems.

Bunk.

I crash this machine multiple times a week. I can reproduce a crash reliably. If I login to my Windows XP machine from OSX (ie I open a folder on the windows box), initiate a file copy, then do anything else that accesses that machine (move an icon, try to open a folder etc) then I get the spinning pizza wheel of death. Other applications behave normally, even the dock, but the finder is crashed. If I force quit (ie relaunch) the finder, I get a blank desktop with a dark background menu bar. Nothing I do will bring the finder back to life. I can still launch and use other apps, but the finder is dead dead dead.

If I try to logout I can't as, I can't access the apple menu. If I hold down the power bar and select restart - nothing happens. Same with sleep or shutdown. I have to press and hold the power key (this is a powerbook) until I force a shutdown, then restart.

THAT my friends, is a hard crash - and I get it several times a week.

Running Panther, fully updated, and I did a repair permissions and attempted Norton Disk Doctor - all to no avail.

Suggestions?

Switch to Linux?

Give up on a stable OS period?
 
Do you notice that the reason why your computer crashes is because you are using a Microsoft product? From what I can tell from your post, you are using the Microsoft Remote Desktop client - Very buggy... For tips when this happends Hold Command-Option and tap Escape. The Force Quit dialog will apear (even if the finder is whacky.) The finder in my experiance has to be re-launched multiple times to get it working normally. But almost everytime it goes squirrly on me, is because of a crap program, made my MS.

Sorry for the rant.
 
I use Microsoft Remote Desktop Connection daily and I have never had any problems on the mac side, although the remote pc has gone wobbly more than once.

Neuby, you need to give us some more information. Did you update to recently? If so, _how_ did you perform the update?

Also, consider Norton software to be the digital equivalent of dog shit .. keep it away from your computer.

I'm running Panther [10.3.2] and have yet to even get a wobble of instability, it is a rock.

Yes, we need more information from you before we can help you out...
 
I have heard from many people that the latest build of OS X (10.3.something) is buggy and the word from apple-care is to revert back to a pre-update version of X. Maybe this will solve your problem?
 
Natobasso said:
I have heard from many people that the latest build of OS X (10.3.something) is buggy and the word from apple-care is to revert back to a pre-update version of X. Maybe this will solve your problem?
Click to expand...

That's a classic case of the cure is worse than the ailment...
 
10.3 is extremely stable. I have it on three machines, works perfectly. Most people don't have problems, but you need to tell us more about your setup. Model, ram, etc.

Norton's, all by itself, could be causing your problems.
 
I must admit that I have found myself rebooting OS X 10.3.2 several times in the last week or two, but in every case it was because I was installing one update or another. I have never had a kernel panic even in the OS X Public Beta and never since then. My Macs all run 24x7 usually for weeks or months on end without restarting except for updates. OS X is inherently extremely stable!

Since you are crashing as often as you say you are there have to be reasons for it but without further information regarding your hardware and software configuration and the crashes you are having there is no way to help you debug the system.
 
10.3.2 is rock solid for me, it has _never_ crashed and i've never had to log out or reboot because something wasn't responding. I can't remember how long ago i intsalled panther, but i have probably rebooted less than 5 times, only b/c some installions forced me to do so
 
Jamesrdorn said:
Do you notice that the reason why your computer crashes is because you are using a Microsoft product? From what I can tell from your post, you are using the Microsoft Remote Desktop client - Very buggy... For tips when this happends Hold Command-Option and tap Escape. The Force Quit dialog will apear (even if the finder is whacky.) The finder in my experiance has to be re-launched multiple times to get it working normally. But almost everytime it goes squirrly on me, is because of a crap program, made my MS.

Sorry for the rant.
Click to expand...

Nope - I am simply accessing a folder on the WinXP hard drive. Not running any MS programs on the Mac at the time. Even if I were - the supposed 'multi threaded', 'protected memory', 'pre-emptive multi tasking' features of MacOSX are supposed to enable one app to crash, and be recovered without affecting the rest of the system. THis is not happening.
 
Running a powerbook 15" G4 1GHz, OS 10.3.2, 768M RAM. Have the problem with other apps running, or even with only the finder active.

Machine originally came with Jaguar, and I upgraded to Panther in November. Also included with the 'upgrade' was my mail filter which used to catch just about everything, is now letting through about 200 messages a day. Can't tell if this is the machine, or the spammers getting smarter.
 
Still: What build of Mac OS X are you using? Did you clean install the last 'big' upgrade (10.2.0, 10.3.0)? Have you tried accessing _another_ WinXP machine and if so: Does it happen there, too? (I've done what you do with my machines, no Finder crashing here...) And: You've seen that other apps keep on working just fine, so I guess you'd have to refine your argument: It's not the system that is unstable, it's the Finder. Or one feature of the Finder even.

And that link was about submitting a bug report, which should be the first thing you do when you encounter a problem that you can't seem to solve. It's quite possible that Apple takes them seriously and solves the problem for you in an update. The fact that you didn't name the build you're running 'til now let's me guess that maybe you're running an outdated version?
 
And btw.: It _could_ be the server's (WinXP) fault. Maybe it has a worm on it that interferes with file transfers. That's why I suggest also trying another WinXP machine/installation.
 
Let's see, running Norton on OSX AND messing with XP. Isn't that like playing Russian Roulette with six bullets in the chamber?
 
neuby said:
Nope - I am simply accessing a folder on the WinXP hard drive. Not running any MS programs on the Mac at the time. Even if I were - the supposed 'multi threaded', 'protected memory', 'pre-emptive multi tasking' features of MacOSX are supposed to enable one app to crash, and be recovered without affecting the rest of the system. THis is not happening.
Click to expand...

I hate to agree with you, but I've had similar problems. When using a certain protocol to access a Windows XP machine (SMB, I believe) my system would become unresponsive until the file copy was complete. I even managed to kernel panic it once or twice when pushing my system to perform another task (launch a program, access the Finder, etc.) while the copy was taking place.

The solution I found was to use FTP instead of SMB. Works flawlessly -- not a lag or kernel panic in sight. I know it's kind of a crappy workaround, but it works. Apple's revising their network "connectability" costantly (some will notice the different ways in how they connect to servers from 10.1 to 10.2 to 10.3) so I think it just has a few kinks to work out. Plus, Microsoft has been known to take a pretty standard thing (like SMB) and add their own proprietary stuff to it, sometimes with ill effects.

I hope this problem won't turn you from OS X, as I think you'll find, with more use, that OS X is a much better computing environment than Windows -- more stable, more efficient, and more pleasureable.
 
It's times like these that I back up my work, get comfortable, break out the installer cd's and a do a clean install.

I'd say that the update has utterly messed things up for you, plus running Norton isn't going to help at all...
 
One thing you could try: Download a Wintel program called FTPCommander (several years old & FREE), turn on FTP in Sharing in the Mac System Preferences, log into your Mac from the PC via FTP, and copy you files from the PC to the Mac. This is what I did in graduate school, never had a crash, and, it was F A S T!!!
 
chemistry_geek said:
One thing you could try: Download a Wintel program called FTPCommander (several years old & FREE), turn on FTP in Sharing in the Mac System Preferences, log into your Mac from the PC via FTP, and copy you files from the PC to the Mac. This is what I did in graduate school, never had a crash, and, it was F A S T!!!
Click to expand...

Will give that a look - thanks.
 
Crashing the whole machine in OS X consistently is the EXCEPTION, not the rule. Yes, Apps still crash here and there for all of us from time to time, but I would have a very hard time purposely bringing down any of my machines in OS X.

Currently running latest OS X.3.2 on iBook, DP G4 867, DP G4 1 GHZ, iMac 400 MHZ and G4 466. Not a single one of them has a full system crash more than once a quarter (though it can happen rarely).

I stand behind OS X's classificaiton as highly stable. It blows any version of OS 9 away for stability.

Now it does sound like in your situation, you may have found one of those niche areas where it will in fact bring down the system consistently. Hopefully you can provide feedback to Apple and help us get this cleared up.
 
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