cut files / rename files

S

stig

Registered
i'm new, so...

what is the most easy way to CUT files and paste them somewhere else in the finder? I know you can copy files and then delete the old one afterwards, but i think that's a double work no ?

can you only rename files in the finder?

if yes, is there a way to go faster to the map i'm workin in ?

tx
 
Unlike Windows, you cannot Cut a file or folder, then paste it in another location using the Edit Menu commands. Apple tends to favour drag-and-drop methods, keeping with their logical, 'computers made for people' philosophy. The danger is that if you Cut a file, then copy another file before pasting the first, that file is erased from the clipboard and lost.

Having said that, I personally think you should be able to cut and paste files like in Windows, but it's not a huge deal.

The methods I use to move files are:
  • Change to List or Column view so that both the source and destnation folders can be seen in the same Finder window, then click and drag the file(s) I want to the new location. (you can change the views at the upper-left of the Finder window, next to the Back/Forward buttons. If you can't see them, click the rectangular button at the top-right corner of the window to expand your options).
  • Drag file(s) to the desktop, then change to the destination folder in the Finder and drag the file back from the desktop to the new location.
  • Find the file(s) you want to move, then open a new Finder window (by double-clicking 'Macintosh HD' or whenever) and dragging from one window to the other (hold Command if moving between 2 seperate drives or it will copy the file).
Apparently OS X 10.5 is going to see some major changes to the Finder, so this may not be an issue for much longer :D
 
By holding the Command (Apple) key while dragging the file, you are moving the files instead of coying it. The plus sign (which indicates copying) disappears.
 
Thank The Cheese said:
The danger is that if you Cut a file, then copy another file before pasting the first, that file is erased from the clipboard and lost.
Click to expand...
This is not accurate because, in Windows, there is no danger of this. Cutting a file in Windows, and then copying or cutting another, cancels the first cut request. The original file that you cut is not actually cut, it is marked as being the last thing for which a cut command was issued, and the icon changes to semi-transparent to show the user this. It is not removed, and remains where it is under a paste command is issued. A copy or cut command after the first cut command cancels the first cut command.

That being said, the Mac should have this. There really is no excuse. If they wanted to keep it away from novice users, they could make it an option that has to be turned on in some preference panel or in the Finder preferences. Every app supports it, and so should the Finder.

I use an Automator workflow for moving files. It's saved as a plugin for the Finder. Read up on this and create the workflow if you want. The downside is that it's ultra-slow, and you wait and wait...and then wait some more...for the dialog to appear that asks you where you want to move the file. It's only slightly helpful if you have to move a file very far down a directory tree. I hardly use it, but it's a good intro project for Automator, so you can check it out and learn a little more about using Automator to make life easier.
 
dmetzcher said:
This is not accurate because, in Windows, there is no danger of this. Cutting a file in Windows, and then copying or cutting another, cancels the first cut request. The original file that you cut is not actually cut, it is marked as being the last thing for which a cut command was issued, and the icon changes to semi-transparent to show the user this. It is not removed, and remains where it is under a paste command is issued. A copy or cut command after the first cut command cancels the first cut command.

That being said, the Mac should have this. There really is no excuse. If they wanted to keep it away from novice users, they could make it an option that has to be turned on in some preference panel or in the Finder preferences. Every app supports it, and so should the Finder.

I use an Automator workflow for moving files. It's saved as a plugin for the Finder. Read up on this and create the workflow if you want. The downside is that it's ultra-slow, and you wait and wait...and then wait some more...for the dialog to appear that asks you where you want to move the file. It's only slightly helpful if you have to move a file very far down a directory tree. I hardly use it, but it's a good intro project for Automator, so you can check it out and learn a little more about using Automator to make life easier.
Click to expand...

Not only is the the file not lost and the cut command ignored, but if you accidentally cut a file you can press ctrl z or go the the trash bin and get it back in a second.
 
dmetzcher said:
This is not accurate because, in Windows, there is no danger of this. Cutting a file in Windows, and then copying or cutting another, cancels the first cut request. The original file that you cut is not actually cut, it is marked as being the last thing for which a cut command was issued, and the icon changes to semi-transparent to show the user this.
Click to expand...

true, true, but that's a problem in itself, because it is failed, confusing logic, which is one of the major problems with Windows. If you Cut a file, it should be cut altogether, otherwise it isn't really being cut, it's being "held" or "marked". Apple have obviously realised this, hence only allowing you to move with the mouse.

I realise the cut paste thing isn't too hard to grasp for you or I, because we know how to use computers, but people who don't know may get confused.

I think they should introduce a "Move..." item in the Edit menu. When you select a file(s), the Move... becomes active. When you select the item, a navigation window pops up and asks for a destination. This is logical and easy to grasp for beginners before they discover better ways.
 
Yeah, drag-n-drop is the only way to move files in the Finder. But there are two handy tricks that might not be immediately obvious:

1. When you drag a file, you can navigate through folders using "spring loaded folder". As you drag the file, hold it over a folder for a while, and it will spring open. You can hit the space bar while hovering over a folder to force it to spring immediately. This can be configured (and disabled) in the Finder's Preferences.

2. You can use Exposé while dragging. Begin the drag, hit F10, and then you can easily drop it into another Finder window that might have previously been invisible.
 
good tips Mikuro! Forgot about Expose. I don't use it often, but it can come in handy. I actually didn't know pressing Space forced spring loading. cool! :D
 
Thank The Cheese said:
true, true, but that's a problem in itself, because it is failed, confusing logic, which is one of the major problems with Windows. If you Cut a file, it should be cut altogether, otherwise it isn't really being cut, it's being "held" or "marked". Apple have obviously realised this, hence only allowing you to move with the mouse.

I realise the cut paste thing isn't too hard to grasp for you or I, because we know how to use computers, but people who don't know may get confused.

I think they should introduce a "Move..." item in the Edit menu. When you select a file(s), the Move... becomes active. When you select the item, a navigation window pops up and asks for a destination. This is logical and easy to grasp for beginners before they discover better ways.
Click to expand...
I agree with the Move item idea.
I also want cut/paste. I understand your concern for new users and novices, however, that should not stop more productive tools from being added. New users will learn cut and paste the same way that they learn how to empty the trash and use a mouse.
 
Thank The Cheese said:
I think they should introduce a "Move..." item in the Edit menu. When you select a file(s), the Move... becomes active. When you select the item, a navigation window pops up and asks for a destination. This is logical and easy to grasp for beginners before they discover better ways.
Click to expand...

I whole heartedly agree with this. Personally, I find the "cut" metaphor to be confusing. Sure, I know what it does, but if I hadn't been told what it did long ago, I'm not sure I would have figured it out on my own.
 
Ah, just forget you've ever been able to cut and paste files and folders. Start to move them. If you cut and paste files and folders for prolonged times a day, your head starts to spin and hurt.

Some things are just different in other systems. Adapt.
 
I should have added a winking smiley. What I wanted to express was the feeling that from the original desktop metaphor point of view, it's not logical to "cut" and "paste" files and folders. To "move" them, however, is clear in that sense.
 
mosx86 said:
...Personally, I find the "cut" metaphor to be confusing. Sure, I know what it does, but if I hadn't been told what it did long ago, I'm not sure I would have figured it out on my own.
Click to expand...

exactly. Look at word processors: if you select a paragraph in TextEdit and choose 'Cut', that paragraph will be completely removed until it is pasted. If you copy another paragraph before pasting the first, the cut paragraph is pretty much lost.

So if Apple chose to do Cut and Paste the Windows way, they will have contradicting logic in two of their own applications. That's just not the Apple way.
 
Thank The Cheese said:
exactly. Look at word processors: if you select a paragraph in TextEdit and choose 'Cut', that paragraph will be completely removed until it is pasted. If you copy another paragraph before pasting the first, the cut paragraph is pretty much lost.

So if Apple chose to do Cut and Paste the Windows way, they will have contradicting logic in two of their own applications. That's just not the Apple way.
Click to expand...
OK, call it "mark" then, instead of cut. I don't care what they call it, frankly. I just want the functionality. They can call it "move this file to a new location if you want, but if you copy something else in the meantime, this file will not be moved when you select paste from any of our lovely drop-down menus".

How's that? ;) I know it might not fit in the limited menu space, but who cares? I like it!

This next bit isn't directed at anyone in particular...

For everyone who says that Apple will not be adding this in some future release...remember that they were never coming out with a two-button mouse...oh, and that Intel's chips sucked and they'll never use them....that too. The writing is on the wall. The more the Mac OS makes its way into the homes and offices of new customers, the more the Mac OS will begin to cater to those new customers. One of the best selling points for any OS is that you don't have to learn it in order to use it. We all know that there is some level of learning with any new OS, but when you are trying to sell to business and home users, saying something like, "this is better than what you have, and you won't really have much of a learning curve if you switch to our product", goes a long way. It's what sells things to businesses and consumers alike.

I see a lot of comments on message boards that say something to the effect of, "I want to be different. I don't want this added, or that added." Forget that the feature would help them. It's all about not being like you-know-who for them. Do you think that Apple is going to cater to them, or the masses? I'll put my money on the masses, because Apple, in the beginning and the end, is a corporation looking to make money. Love Steve Jobs all you want, but he is not your friend. He is, always has been, and always will be, a businessman. Apple doesn't want a niche market. They want to ditch the niche, and go broader than that, just like every other publicly held company.

:D

Anyway, I hope they add "cut" to the list of great features. With an OS this advanced, it's the little things that I nit-pick, because I don't really have any major complaints.
 
I agree that Cut is an annoying missing feature in OS X when you're used to Windows.

Another good way to move things is to drag the file to the dock, then navigate to the folder you want to go to, and Cmd+Drag the file or folder out of the Dock into that folder.
 
dmetzcher said:
OK, call it "mark" then, instead of cut. I don't care what they call it, frankly. I just want the functionality. They can call it "move this file to a new location if you want, but if you copy something else in the meantime, this file will not be moved when you select paste from any of our lovely drop-down menus".

How's that? ;) I know it might not fit in the limited menu space, but who cares? I like it!

This next bit isn't directed at anyone in particular...

...Anyway, I hope they add "cut" to the list of great features. With an OS this advanced, it's the little things that I nit-pick, because I don't really have any major complaints.
Click to expand...

I'd love to see them add the functionality to the contextual menu. But let's just call it Move (the *nix command is mv afterall (ditto would just be silly)).
 
I absolutelly agree that the cut paradigm is NOT user-friendly... at least to users nos MS-shaped. I think the "Move" idea is great, and goes way back to the 60s with Unix and it is more faithfull to the physical world (which is always good in usability!). Still, SOME way of doin it is necessary! I've seen in lots of Mac-native apps the "Cut" command in a contextual (or Edit) menu (iPhoto, for example), but it's always disabled. Haven't figured out the reason for this, though...
Anyway, what has worked great for me (even greater than cutting) is using exposé. And it's preety cool if you set it up in a hot corner (a personal show-off favorite ;-) ).
 
I personally miss the cut paste option since my move to Mac.
It did make moving files a lot easier, without the hassle of navigating from one window to the next while dragging etc.
I also think MS had a good solution in the way that if you didn't paste the file back the cut was abandoned - I should add this is one minor Pro for an otherwise vastly inferior OS.
What I want is one-handed (left handed) file selection and move with keyboard shortcuts. Windows does this with ctrl-X, ctrl-v which has some logic, but I can understand the hesitation some of you have.
I was delighted to find that "Mac Pilot" has a preference setting to enable cut files, but disappointed that it seems to cut them into thin air, but refuse to paste them anywhere! Thank goodness for "Undo"! I quickly abandoned that solution.
I think the solution is going to have to come from Apple, but please Apple, make it one(left) handed and driven by only a single keyboard shortcut to cut (or "mark to move") and one to paste.
 
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