Exasperated with Panther!

B

biscotte

Music writer
Hi!

Having problems with Capturing with FCE in Panther, I would like to un-install Panther and re-install Jaguar, at least temporarily.

Is there any particular way of doing that.

Thanks for your help!


biscotte
 
Pretty much the same way you'd install anything... run the Jaguar installer while booted off the CD. I'd say do an archive & install to keep your Panther folder alive.

The only problem might be that some files will try to open in the Panther version of that program, like TextEdit... in this case, you should backup and remove the Panther version of any offending programs. (As in on external media.)
 
arden said:
Pretty much the same way you'd install anything... run the Jaguar installer while booted off the CD. I'd say do an archive & install to keep your Panther folder alive.

The only problem might be that some files will try to open in the Panther version of that program, like TextEdit... in this case, you should backup and remove the Panther version of any offending programs. (As in on external media.)
Click to expand...

Thank you, arden, for your prompt reply.

I'll do what you suggested.

While you're there, you might be able to help me with another small problem.

Ever since I installed Panther on my internal drive, I can't change my startup disk. I do have 2 external firewire Lacie drive (80 GB and 120 GB). Each one has Jaguar on it. But even if I change the startup disk in the system preferences, my computer keeps starting up with Panther.

Any suggestion?

Thanks


biscotte
 
Try holding down the option key after you restart your computer. Keep holding it down until you are presented with a menu that will let you choose which disk to start up from.

If that doesn't work, you can try restarting and then holding down Shift-Option-Command-Delete. That'll force your computer to look for other bootable partitions from which to boot. It may or may not find your Jaguar installations on your firewire drives.
 
ElDiabloConCaca said:
Try holding down the option key after you restart your computer. Keep holding it down until you are presented with a menu that will let you choose which disk to start up from.

If that doesn't work, you can try restarting and then holding down Shift-Option-Command-Delete. That'll force your computer to look for other bootable partitions from which to boot. It may or may not find your Jaguar installations on your firewire drives.
Click to expand...


Thank you, ElDiabloConCaca.

I did what you suggested.

When I hold down the option key, I have no choice... the only drive that shows up is my internal drive with Panther. As if there was no system installed on my external drives, but there is... Jaguar on both of them.

As for the other method, all I get when I hold Shift-Option-Command-Delete is the computer again starting up with Panther on the internal drive, but with the extensions off.

I'm quite lost!

If you have any other suggestions, they will be welcome. Otherwise, it seems that the only choice I've got is to re-install Jaguar on my internal drive... but for some reason, I'm a bit scared of doing that with all the weird things that happened since the installation of Panther.

In the meantime, I hope a solution can be found to my system and/or my FCE problems.

I'm on stand by!

Thank you.


biscotte
 
Oh, if you haven't heard, there's a problem with certain firewire drives and Panther. It appears that Panther can corrupt FireWire 800 drives when it restarts, so if you've got your firewire drives connected when you're installing Panther on the internal drive, when the installer restarts your computer, it can corrupt the data on the FireWire drives. What happens is that certain "timed commands" like the command for the drive to eject or unmount before the computer restarts is getting all messed up with Panther. It's not Panther's fault, it's not the drive's fault, it's a combination of the two. Check with the vendor of your firewire drive and see if there's a firmware update for it -- that should take care of that problem.

I would suggest running Disk Utility to check your firewire drives for errors, and until you've gotten the update for your drive, disconnect it from the computer if you restart or shut down. That could be the reason your computer will let you select the drive in the Startup Disks panel but not actually boot from it.
 
ElDiabloConCaca said:
Oh, if you haven't heard, there's a problem with certain firewire drives and Panther. It appears that Panther can corrupt FireWire 800 drives when it restarts, so if you've got your firewire drives connected when you're installing Panther on the internal drive, when the installer restarts your computer, it can corrupt the data on the FireWire drives. What happens is that certain "timed commands" like the command for the drive to eject or unmount before the computer restarts is getting all messed up with Panther. It's not Panther's fault, it's not the drive's fault, it's a combination of the two. Check with the vendor of your firewire drive and see if there's a firmware update for it -- that should take care of that problem.

I would suggest running Disk Utility to check your firewire drives for errors, and until you've gotten the update for your drive, disconnect it from the computer if you restart or shut down. That could be the reason your computer will let you select the drive in the Startup Disks panel but not actually boot from it.
Click to expand...

Now I feel I'm going somewhere, ElDiabloConCaca.

So I'll just start doing what you suggest, even though my drives are not Firewire 800. I'll also run Disk Utility to check the external drives.

So keep the suggestions coming, everybody... I want to solve this problem.

Thank you!


biscotte
 
Please help me!

I'm totally frustrated with Panther.

After installing it, I found out I could not Capture in Final Cut Express anymore. Yet, FCE was perfect in Jaguar.

So, then, I decided to startup from my external drive which has Jaguar on it. Panther won't let me. If I choose that other drive as the startup drive, it will still start in Panther anyway!
If I startup holding the option key, I don't even have the choice: only the internal drive with Panther shows up.

So, I decide to re-install Jaguar from the CDs.
Well, believe it or not, I CAN'T DO THAT EITHER. Whether I double-click on the Install Mac OS X icon on the CD, or choose the Install CD as the startup disk, or even startup the computer holding down the C key, it ignores all that and keeps starting in Panther.

I don't know what to do anymore.

Can anyone help me, please.

Thank you!


biscotte
 
Hmm... unfortunately, the only thing I can suggest is a clean install of Jaguar. Don't do that just yet though. Wait for a more educated Mac individual can give a response to your problem (and hopefully better news).

BTW, did you update Jaguar when installing Panther? Or did you do a clean install of Panther? Alot of things do not work correctly I noticed when I decided to just update Jaguar to Panther... it would run slow or freeze and a lot things were incorrect. However, once I backed everything important up and did a clean install of Panther, everything worked as it was supposed to (not to mention the installation went by much quicker).

I hope you somehow find this useful. If not, I'm sure someone else can give you better advice.
 
Here I am again, ElDiabloConCaca to report back to you.
I feel I owe you that much.

Nothing seems to be wrong with my external disk.
I even plugged it on my other computer holding down the option key, and there was the external drive... I started from it fine.

Everything is happening on my computer with Panther in the internal drive.

You probably saw that I posted a new thread to deal with that problem only... it's called "Exasperated with Panther".

Thanks again, ElDiabloConCaca and arden. If you find further solutions to my problem, don't hesitate to reply to this or to the other thread.

I'll be watching.


biscotte
 
The Nobody said:
Hmm... unfortunately, the only thing I can suggest is a clean install of Jaguar. Don't do that just yet though. Wait for a more educated Mac individual can give a response to your problem (and hopefully better news).

BTW, did you update Jaguar when installing Panther? Or did you do a clean install of Panther? Alot of things do not work correctly I noticed when I decided to just update Jaguar to Panther... it would run slow or freeze and a lot things were incorrect. However, once I backed everything important up and did a clean install of Panther, everything worked as it was supposed to (not to mention the installation went by much quicker).

I hope you somehow find this useful. If not, I'm sure someone else can give you better advice.
Click to expand...


I do find it useful, indeed, The Nobody.

At the risk of looking ignorant, would you tell me how to do a clean install. Does it have to do with backing everything up and initializing the drive first and then installing Panther on it?

That is frightening!

Thank you for your advice.


biscotte
 
A clean install isn't the same as reformatting (that would be a last resort). What Nobody meant was, when you installed Panther, did you choose the Upgrade option (installing on top of Jaguar), or a clean install (ignoring Jaguar and installing Panther from scratch). I did an Upgrade and things have been fine, however others have experienced problems so doing a clean install could help. You don't have to go reformatting anything.
 
monktus said:
A clean install isn't the same as reformatting (that would be a last resort). What Nobody meant was, when you installed Panther, did you choose the Upgrade option (installing on top of Jaguar), or a clean install (ignoring Jaguar and installing Panther from scratch). I did an Upgrade and things have been fine, however others have experienced problems so doing a clean install could help. You don't have to go reformatting anything.
Click to expand...

Thank you, monktus!

This will eventually help me.

But going back to my original problem, I'd like right now to re-install Jaguar which Panther won't let me do. I can't even start from the install CD.

If you have an answer to that, THAT would really help me, presently.

Thanks


biscotte
 
Is your external drive a firewire drive? There has been mention on a lot of mac sites about firewire issues with panther, in some cases it can cause data corruption.

When you first went to install Panther, on the screen where it would let you choose your hard drive to install it on, there is a button on the left side of the window labeled 'options'.

If you didn't click on that button, I believe that the default choice made by the installer app is to upgrade the existing OS (Jaguar in this case).

Some people have had problems with this approach in the past.

One of the options you can choose when installing is to 'archive and install', what this does is take your existing system folders/files and moves them to a new folder, and does a clean install of Panther.

Probably a better way to do it, but one of the drawbacks to this approach is that any files that an application like FCE would have installed in the previous system folder, now needs to be transfered to the new system folder. Or you could just re-install the application afterwards, with your fresh OS install.

Good luck
 
naodx said:
Is your external drive a firewire drive? There has been mention on a lot of mac sites about firewire issues with panther, in some cases it can cause data corruption.

When you first went to install Panther, on the screen where it would let you choose your hard drive to install it on, there is a button on the left side of the window labeled 'options'.

If you didn't click on that button, I believe that the default choice made by the installer app is to upgrade the existing OS (Jaguar in this case).

Some people have had problems with this approach in the past.

One of the options you can choose when installing is to 'archive and install', what this does is take your existing system folders/files and moves them to a new folder, and does a clean install of Panther.

Probably a better way to do it, but one of the drawbacks to this approach is that any files that an application like FCE would have installed in the previous system folder, now needs to be transfered to the new system folder. Or you could just re-install the application afterwards, with your fresh OS install.

Good luck
Click to expand...


Thank you naodx.

Yes both my external drives are Firewire 400 (as you can see in my signature)

Not being able right now to re-install Jaguar as I explained earlier, I will try to do a clean install of Panther over itself if it lets me startup from the install CD, which I can't do with the Jaguar install disk.

Unfortunately, I won't be able to check that right away since it's pretty late and I really have to go to sleep.

I'll keep you and the others informed tomorrow.

Thank you all.

Talk to you later.


biscotte
 
try to corrupt panther by installing a theme... then install jaguar... lol i dunno... i think panther dosnt let you use jaguar once its on your system.
did your system come with panther, if it did, then thats why it wont install.
 
Have you re-installed Final Cut Express after upgrading from Jaguar? If any issues with software occur after a major system upgrade occur the first thing you should try is re-installing the software. If that doesn't work you should visit the software vendor's website (in this case Apple) to see if there is a notice of any incompatability and (hopefully) an update (for Final Cut Express). The bug you mention about not being able to start-up from a firewire drive is a known bug in 10.3 which is something Apple is reported to be working on for the 10.3.1 update.
 
If he can get to the point where he can start up from the jaguar cd, he can re-install jaguar. I know for a fact that it won't let you 'upgrade' for obvious reasons, but it will let you do an initialize and install (not sure if it would let you do a clean install or not).

I had to do this to my brothers b&w g3, as 10.3 had some issues with his hard drives that are connected via a sonnettech ata-66 card (finder would never respond giving a continuos spinning beach ball).

Anyways it would be worth a try to see if he could do an archive and install...if he could get his computer to start up from the jaguar cd. Not to sound demeaning, but are you sure your holding down the 'c' key long enough after restarting your computer with the jag cd in the drive? (I'm always paranoid myself, and hold it down until I see the install screen come up.)
 
Hi!

I'm back.

Thank you UNIX X11. Can you explain a bit "try to corrupt panther by installing a theme". I think I understand the intention but I don't quite understand the means.
And no, my system did not come with Panther, it did with Jaguar 10.2.6 and I did an upgrade, not a clean install (that may be the cause of my problems).

To answer dagaz's question, yes I did re-install FCE after upgrading from Jaguar. No change in FCE's behavior. And as far as I can see, Apple has no update for that software (except 1.0.1 which is the version I re-installed). As for Panther, nothing there yet.

And, naodx, not being able to start up from the Jaguar CD is really my biggest problem presently. And yes, I hold the "c" key for a long time... actually, I just found out, before coming back here, that I can boot from my Panther CD. But I'm not there yet. I don't know if that will help me, but if I can't start up from my Jaguar CD, I'm left with the choice of trying and make a clean install of Panther.

But I'll wait a bit and do that later on today, in case other options come my way through this forum.

You can all be assured that I'll keep you posted on any type of development.

Again, thank you all, and keep the ideas coming. It's good not to feel alone in the world with one's problems.

Back later!


biscotte
 
Eureka!

My biggest problem has been solved!

I just decided to try and clean install Panther just now. And BINGO! Capturing in FCE works perfectly now.

So even though I still can't boot in Jaguar, there's no need for it anymore.

THANK YOU! Thank you all for your cooperation and good advice.
You've all been of great help.

I feel so good now, thanks to you.


biscotte
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top