Grammar matters!

MDLarson

MDLarson

Registered
Well, after reading what a few people have said regarding the subject of grammar, let's have a lively little chat about it here!

I think it's important to successfully communicate and articulate whatever it is you're trying to say–otherwise your paragraphs are more susceptible to misunderstanding. So to me, grammar is worth striving for.

What do YOU think?


And now through the Dialectizer! (Hacker dialect)
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well, aftar er4ding what a few doodz ahve sdaid regardi|\|g Teh subject o fgra/\/\mar, let"s have A lively little caht about it her3!!!!!!!!!!!!1~~~~~~ 1 think it"z impprotaznt to successfully communic4te and artIci8l whatevbert it is ur trying to say–tehrwisde youre p4ragraphs r mroe susceptible tyo misuindetstandign!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111~~~ so t0 me, gr4mmar is worth striving fro!!!!!!!!111~~~ what do you think!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?? olol!!!!!!!!!!!11~~~~
 
My friend and me think bad is grammar!

Actually I think grammar has its place, as far as things like ~~NeYo~~ go, but constant pestering about using "I" instead of "me" should problably be avoided. I would be surprised to see many english majors here, or other language students (with the exclusion of Admiral, he's just a player;)).:D
 
I guess I'm a bit suspicious of the folks who insist on "linguistic precision".

As long as we can understand each other, that's what is important. If some folks are hard to understand, that become part of the challange. Some people take longer than others to get to know, and the same is true for their written personna's.

I know MANY people will disagree with this sentiment, but this is my 2¢...


If MacOSX.com would enable the spell checking feature that is part of this forum software, that would go a long way to making things better. In the meantime, most of the issues that folks complain about will continue to be spelling/typing errors... not grammar issues.
 
I agree that the most important thing is being understood. If I have to read what you write two or three times in order to understand it, not because it's complicated, but because you're not making any fricking sense, there's a problem.

Curiously though, I like ~~NeYo~~. He's got style, even if I'm a bit skeptical about his syntax. And he's always so upbeat about everything that it's hard to dislike him. In my opinion.

But I think that it's good to pay attention to the details too. If two people are having an argument (um, I mean "debate"), and one person says, "I think your wrong about that," I'm instantly going to take that person a little less seriously. If they speak English and can't put in the effort to make sure their grammar is right, I get the impression that they just don't care enough to polish a little bit, and that will negatively affect how I view their argument.

So while I like ~~NeYo~~, I do find it extremely difficult to take him seriously. :D

-the valrus
 
well, i did start my first go around in college as an english major:D and while i think grammer is important, i think knowing when and how to break the rules of grammer to communicate in a more casual or contemporary way is also important. I also think there is a big difference between applying these standards to english speaking people and those who have other first languages.

i don't think it helps to criticize anyone for their misuse of grammer but i have noticed that some non english speaking people actually appreciate the help when you correct something in a polite way. I know i would if i were typing in a second language.

but i would agree that grammer reflects on a person overall. but reflections of ourselves can be good or bad, it depends on what we make them.;)
 
your your your your your yoru your!!!

Its a casual error. I don't think it really is a big problem. You know what the person means. Its just a mistake. I'm typing fast and I forget to spell it 'you're'.

Honestly who proofreads their posts. I don't! and I wont proofread this one either! :D

I don't think we need to be perfect on here. You have to sound decent, but I dont think we should be pointing out if somebody uses 'your' instead of 'you're'.

If me write this way all times and it wasnt well. Wroting will be bad to understand.

But, unless someone is really butchering it I think we should all just leave them alone.
 
Grammar matters, sure it does. But to point at people's grammar constantly is unnecessary. I agree that the most important thing is to understand eachother.
But what's even more annoying than spelling-mistakes is verbal mistakes. I don't know if this is common among people who has english as their mothertongue, but it is among some other languages. I think it's sad when people don't even "care" enough to pronounce things correctly.

- On this board it's important to remember that not everybody has english as their mothertongue. Perhaps english isn't even their second language. This requires patience.


Kris
 
I'd agree that communication is the goal. Proper spelling and grammar are just means to the end.

I also think maturity has a lot to do with it-- sometimes people (trolls) just come in and spout off. They don't really want to communicate anything, just tick people off.

Anyway, I'm glad this board has mature members that care about communication (for the most part :p )!
 
mmm hacker talk :p
I had a program a while back that allowed me to just give it a simple text file of text and it would convert the text to hacker-talk tecxt :)
 
Valrus seems to be overly concerned with your/you're. Not that I am criticizing -- I jump all over its/it's and their/there/they're. Or other trivial things.

Like 'plex saying "Its a casual error" -- should be "It's a casual error" since it's is a contraction of it is, and its is possessive it.

And grammer isn't a word, but grammar is.

Oh, wait, we're supposed to be more tolerant of grammar? Sorry, went the wrong way.

Seriously, I agree with Valrus -- the important thing is understanding. This is not a technical forum, nor even professional. I do actually proofread my posts, sometimes more than once. I'm not about to ask everyone else to do the same, though.

I'm not a big fan of pointing out grammatical usage no matter how poorly a poster slaughters it. I will do so in everyday life, but only if I know the person speaking. For instance, I have a friend who constantly mixes up words. She uses words that may sound similar to what she wants, but the meaning is completely different. I sometimes correct her -- not to be nitpicky, but because she gets upset when people think her stupid for her speech patterns. If I notice her use a specific word over and over, and it is the wrong word, I'll tell her, so in the future she might use the correct one. I don't do this frequently, and it has never become a sore point.

If I am proofreading a paper, no matter how technical or professional, I will jump on every single grammatical error -- I think it's only fair if I have been asked to do exactly that. I have not been asked to proof anyone's posts, so I don't. I once pointed out an 'excessive pronoun use'. But that was because the post was something like "He has a good point. Ignore his post." Who had a good point? Ignore which post? But ifn i's post a lin like dis, u all kin understood me, tho it might be mo harder.

I find Neyo's posts to be difficult to understand, but I don't think his credibility is diminished because of it (IMO). Besides, most people are lazy typers, and ur is shorter that you're.

I don't see what all the fuss is about...

Post 2 of my posting fast (See the B&G thread for details)
 
Yeah, I'm definitely more anal about grammar than most people. :D

Actually all the things that nkuvu was talking about really bother me. I don't know why, but suffice to say that if I corrected someone every time I saw some grammatical thing that bothered me here, I'd have well over a thousand posts by now... but I don't think I'd get a congratulations thread. :p

But most of the people here are pretty good about it, so I don't feel like I have to bug everyone. I get the impression that people could write with perfect grammar if they wanted to.

But I don't tend to make those kinds of mistakes (your/you're, its/it's, they're/there/their) even when I'm just typing casually. And I don't proofread anything I write other than what I notice while I'm writing (I'll correct typos, obviously, or if I spot a missing apostrpohe I'll fix that) - I just finished an eight-page paper for my math class and didn't proofread it once before I turned it in.

I dunno. I guess I just don't understand how the mistakes made here wouldn't carry over into more official documents, and indeed if they don't, why they're made here and not there. Those aren't the kinds of things you'd catch with a spell checker, so it seems like it would be best to get into the habit of just being a little more aware of what you're typing.

Don't mean to sound like an ass, if indeed I do. I think I got the grammar-stickler thing from my mother.

-the valrus
 
There are people who have some very real problems with language. If it is getting totally out of hand, yes, it should be brought to their attention. Otherwise, pointing out mistakes is just being a grammar troll. There really is no nice way for someone to point that type of stuff out, and I feel that the etiquette problem of the grammar troll is far more egregious than the poster with poor grammar.
 
I think that as long as you're able to effectively communicate, everything should be all right. I think one's grammar is a reflection of education and personality. You're either detail-oriented and want to strive for self-improvement or you're not. Some people are more detail-oriented than others. So what if they're not? It's the way they are and they're happy with themselves, there's no need to criticize if the general idea is clearly expressed with some grammatical errors. I see many mistakes in other people's posts, and I have never commented about grammar, though I do remember mocking ~~NeYo~~'s writing style (...--==[kN0w wH@t ! mEeN?]==--...). We should be nice to each other, there's enough voilence and bad attitude in the world. Why propagate more? Is it really worth the emotional upset?

I don't got no learnins'
 
I spent about a year working as a proof-reader when I finished high-school, and ever since then I've been unable to pick up a newspaper without immediately noticing each and every typo on the page.

As a writer, I tend to be a bit fussy about my use of grammar. As a human being, I know that we not only make mistakes, but mistakes are inevitable. And I'm sure there are a few people on our boards who speak english as a second language, or use a translator.

I think it comes down to showing people that you've put in some thought and effort. You wouldn't trust an accountant who met you for a consultation wearing a Motley Crue T-shirt and torn jeans. You would infer that the accountant simply didn't take you seriously.

Likewise, when somebody offers you a reply that is not only helpful but also neatly stated and easy to understand, then you can see that they respect you and take you seriously. Obviously, there is a limit to how fussy you should be, but I do quickly read over my posts every time, out of respect for the other members.
 
I can understand that, but pointing out that someone used 'your' instead of 'you're' or 'its' instead of 'it's' is a little much don't you think. I mean, we're posting on a message board we're not writing a formal document. I usually try and write properlly, however, I slip sometimes and its not because I dont know I'm just writing a response quickly or something and I don't really feel that it is neccisary to go over it a lot to look for things like that.
 
Heh. If anyone has read the Lord of the Rings or the Hobbit, do not even dare to post Gollum-style.

Example:
Yesssss, my precious, grammar mattersss very much...
Click to expand...

Just trying to spread in a bit of xoot humor here and there.:D
 
Language, including grammar, is a constantly changing thing. People don't speak now the way they did 200 years ago. I think the internet is making these changes happen more rapidly. all lower case text, for example... I began to do this years ago on IRC when you had to keep up with conversations through typing. I write business emails and letters in proper case and punctuation, but that's about it. People I talk with online also do this all the time. How long do you think it will be that books will be published in all lower case, or kids can hand in papers like that?

On the other hand, my mom was an english teacher for many years, and it does bother me to read the word "alot" over and over when there is no such word. When an adult uses made up words, it gives the impression of illiteracy. Of course, with common usage, it (and others) will probably become a word.
 
Grammar is definitely important. It's hard to read posts that that don't use punctuation or proper grammar.

Little errors aren't important (like your for you're or arent for aren't or me and I). They don't have to be perfect, but it's just considerate to use grammar and punctuation

Also, it's really bad when you have a big block of text without line breaks

Without G and P:
grammars definitely important its hard to read posts that that dont use punctuation or proper grammar little errors arent important like your for youre or arent for arent or me and i they dont have to be perfect but its just considerate to use grammar and punctuation also its really bad when you have a big block of text without line breaks

See how much easier it is to read with proper English.:)
 
Former English major here. ;)
And yes, I did get my BA in English.
Grammar can be important. I agree with the posters who regard it as a matter of context. I am not going to sweat the minor errors in posts here. But when I see blatant grammatical errors in print ads for colleges (!), I lose respect for those institutions.
Jadey's comment on the evolutionary nature of language is also a good point. One of the common sayings that has totally changed its (not "it's") meaning is "The exception that proves the rule."
The word "prove" meant "test" at the time that this phrase was coined. So an exception to a rule tested the rule's validity; it did not validate the rule!
:p
 
And don't even get me started on "Wherefore art thou Romeo?" :mad:

-the valrus

P.S. "I art down here! Throw me the car keys!"
-Dave Barry

*shudder*
 
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