Grammar matters!

Valrus, grammar is often sacraficed for poetic beauty.

Which sounds nicer "Wherefor art thou romeo"

OR

"Where the hell are you romeo"

:D
 
Yes, languages change, so that what was a terrible error becomes correct soon enough. And I'm moving into the future of the English language kicking and screaming all the way!

Really, most changes don't bother me too much. But I will continue to use lay and lie correctly to the day I die, even if the language changes 100% so I'm the one using them incorrectly. And I have asked my girlfriend to smother me in my sleep if I start using task as a verb.
 
Originally posted by googolplex
Valrus, grammar is often sacraficed for poetic beauty.

Which sounds nicer "Wherefor art thou romeo"

OR

"Where the hell are you romeo"

:D
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The former. Note that both are fully grammatically correct. They also don't mean the same thing at all - wherefore means why.

"Wherefore art thou Romeo? A rose by any other name would smell as sweet."
Doesn't make much sense if she's talking about his location. She means:
"Why do you have to be Romeo Montague (of the Montagues my parents want to kill)? You'd be just as wonderful if you had some other last name."

I quite like the different forms of address. Knowing the difference between 'you' and 'thou' lets you get different levels of formality across without knowing any elaborate social rituals (which probably change from place to place), just basic grammar. Just like 'du' vs. 'Sie' in German or 'tu' vs. 'vous' in French.

Interestingly, one of the reasons the Quakers fled England for America was that they were persecuted for using 'thee' and 'thou' with everyone - they refused to use the formal 'ye' and 'you' even with priests, nobility, etc. Just by the choice of pronouns, they could constantly reinforce their message - we are equals, there is no rank that matters here on Earth.
 
Googolplex:
Regarding "task," just don't even ask. I frequent this thread (oh really?) and I know I don't want to know.

Regarding Romeo: Actually, I wasn't complaining about the grammar. This time. What I was referring to was the interpretation of the word "wherefore" to mean "where." That really bothers me. It doesn't mean "where." It means, roughly, "why."

So I was actually alluding to the "evolution" of language via Shakespeare. (Oh no! Darwinist propaganda!)

-the valrus
 
Originally posted by googolplex
How do you use task as a verb?

tasking? tasked? to task?
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Lucky you, you haven't heard it yet. It seems to be management-speak, especially in computers. "I am going task you with this", or even "I am going to task you to do this" means "I am going to assign you this (as a task)".
 
Damn, scruffy. I was about to set googolplex straight but you beat me to it. :D

That's another thing. A lot of people seem to think that in Shakespeare, "thou," "thy," etc. are really formal pronouns, when in fact it's the opposite - the pronouns we use today are the formal ones, whereas the "old-sounding" ones were used either to talk to someone you knew well or to insult someone you didn't.

Hence "your Highness," not "Thy Highness." If you ever catch anyone saying "Thy Highness," you'll know they're full of it.

Oh, and that's another thing. When you're trying to emulate Elizabethan speech, do not just slap an "-eth" on the end of every verb. Or an "-est," for that matter. It's just not funny. It's not!

Thank you, come again.

-the valrus
 
When trying to emulate Elizabethan speech, the '-eth' or '-est' are not funny. When trying to poke fun at Elizabethan speech they are. "I am going to tasketh this to thee". It's funny. Laugh. :D Or don't. I think it's funny. :) But only in jest. The same kind of funny when Brad Pitt says "I want a ride in your el trucko" in the Mexican...

So scruffy -- which is lay and which is lie? I constantly get them confused...
 
;)
And
Lie on the couch.
Lay the blanket on the couch.

To lay an object is to place it horizontally - you can lay something, but you cannot just plain lay.
To lie is to be horizontal, or to place yourself horizontally - you don't lie something, just lie.
 
Originally posted by googolplex
But lay is the past tense of lie. Like this:

"I lay down for a bit yesterday".

That is correct. Isn't it?
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I think it's "I laid down for a bit."

-the valrus
 
One more interesting thing is the use of words in type that aren't used in language. For example, often when writing in singular "they" or "their" is used in place of he or she in order to be gender neutral. Other times, s/he is used, but this has no pronunciation. It is a paper-only word.
 
Language evolves in strange ways. Fifteen years ago I doubt that anyone would expect certain words to become verbs.

"I was spammed!"
 
I know quite a few English sticklers (you know who you are ;) ) who insist that using 'they' or 'their' is incorrect for gender neutral speech. There is no good alternative in English, but some people are trying to get new words adopted for gender neutrality.
 
Finnish already is a gender-neutral language. The 3rd-person singular noun is "hän," and you have to figure out from context whether it's "he" or "she."
Finland also has the world's best record of pay equality between the sexes. Coincidence? I wonder...
;)
 
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