I bought my first PC

[solrac]

Originally posted by hulkaros
So, Solrac you have friends who are living in this world and never had a BSOD while using Win(any version)? And this is the truth? What do they do? Play Solitaire? Write documents in Notepad? Oh, Please! THIS IS BS... EVERYONE in the real world using ANY Windows version had a BSOD now and then!

Me too, have spoken with people (not just friends but customers as well) who claimed NOT having a BSOD screen until I pointed out what that BSOD really is... And guess what? They knew what I was talking about...

Maintaining PCs is not just harder but it is useless because one day it just decides to play dead...

Also, try this: Talk to ANYONE and explain to them how your very old and then your old and then your new computer makes you angry for crashing now and then and how you really hate them... Not mentioning the fact that you use a Mac but ANY PC running Windows. You know what? They will understand you and start saying to you that they have more or less similar problems or even worst! Also, if one understands that he/she knows more than you about PCs he/she will try to offer you help by giving you advises like use Windows 2000/XP or buy another device from a well known company and useless tricks like those... But in the end you and you mate will agree that a Wintel machine has its problems, other times strange ones, other times logical ones, and some other times simply paranoid ones! You will agree, agree and agree all of the time if you say the above things. And when you finally decide to tell the truth that you have a Mac and you hate PCs you will see the same person before your eyes changing into another person who hates Macs and loves his PC life ALL the way because he/she doesn't have ANY problems... Yeah, right!

i didn't say that my PC friends never got a blue screen of death.

I'm sure they do every now and then, just like my OS X has gotten a kernel panic 4 or 5 times in the last year and a half. Maybe another 4 or 5 times it just froze and I had to reboot.

But those problems are solved by a reboot, then everything is fine again for a couple months.

This is the promise of Windows XP and Mac OS X.

NO PROBLEMS, except an occasional (rare) system crash, which a reboot solves completely and nothing else happens for a few months.

So far Mac OS X and Windows XP have come through on this. Although Win XP still looks like sh*t compared to OS X, and is harder to use, and harder to learn all the ins and outs of the system, and is not as intuitive and user friendly as mac.

Of course, windows does get all the new hardware, software, and utilities first, like annhiliatus said.

Once Mac OS X saturates the mac market, and millions of new poeple have switched to mac (or bought their first computer, a mac), and more developers work for the mac platform, we'll see lots of utilities, games, and hardware come out right away for mac, as well.

At that point, macs will have ZERO speed issues with the GUI or anything else, and will TOPPLE PCs.

Unless Microsoft can come up with something else by that time. But I see Apple on a path to strong market competitive status, even leadership.

 

[mmilano]

Originally posted by solrac
At that point, macs will have ZERO speed issues with the GUI or anything else, and will TOPPLE PCs.

Unless Microsoft can come up with something else by that time. But I see Apple on a path to strong market competitive status, even leadership.

geez.. i guess you didn't read my post. do you mean mac os will topple microsoft? fyi. a pc is the hardware that you install an operating system on. and if we look at it that way, then a big part of the mac is an "average" pc. ati makes video cards for pc and mac . the ram is cross-platform too... so are hard drives. so as far as hardware is concerned, .. the primary difference between mac and pc is the mobo and processor... and your mac is a big percent that pc's are.

your statement is so narrow minded .. as if mac and windows are the only os in the world.. mac os came from bsd, an os that has been developed on pc's for many years. it will be the unix developers who streamline mac issues who are apart of the open source community which i'm sure as a result, other flavors of *nix will benefit from these sorts of developments.

hello, ... open your mind a little.. remember where os x came from.

hey check it out: http://www.linuxiso.org/ there is just a handfull of other o/s if you don't know anything beyond mac and windows. notice bsd in there too .. yes, say hi to os x's daddy

 

[solrac]

Originally posted by mmilano
geez.. i guess you didn't read my post. do you mean mac os will topple microsoft? fyi. a pc is the hardware that you install an operating system on. and if we look at it that way, then a big part of the mac is an "average" pc. ati makes video cards for pc and mac . the ram is cross-platform too... so are hard drives. so as far as hardware is concerned, .. the primary difference between mac and pc is the mobo and processor... and your mac is a big percent that pc's are.

your statement is so narrow minded .. as if mac and windows are the only os in the world.. mac os came from bsd, an os that has been developed on pc's for many years. it will be the unix developers who streamline mac issues who are apart of the open source community which i'm sure as a result, other flavors of *nix will benefit from these sorts of developments.

hello, ... open your mind a little.. remember where os x came from.

hey check it out: http://www.linuxiso.org/ there is just a handfull of other o/s if you don't know anything beyond mac and windows. notice bsd in there too .. yes, say hi to os x's daddy

Yeah but I'm not talking about hardware, or other OSes.

I'm talking about Mac OS vs Windows OS.

Those are the only OSes that matter to the mass consumer market.

And it's been Windows toppling Mac for a decade now. The tables are slowly turning.

I know of all the other OSes but they are not included in this conversation.

This only relates to the large percentage of the 250 million consumers in america, and more worldwide, that don't even have a computer yet, and never touched one.

For them, it's either Mac or Windows.

And most people will recommend to them Windows. I'm saying, within a couple years, it'll be Mac.

 

[mmilano]

Thank you for rephrasing that =) It is so much easier to read that way

I can't wait for rival *nix o/s available for PC's .. It would be nice to not have to spend an arm and a leg for the proprietary hardware to run X on.

 

[hulkaros]

PC rulez! Ok? No, I really mean this... They rule the world for real! And then comes Hulkaros and tries to defend a crappy OS by the name of Mac OS X and all of a sudden he and that OS are BS!

Personal experience friends not with one PC, not two, not even a thousand....

Its more like tens of thousands! No really! That little... As I said before for MANY-MANY years I work as a PC technician and for the past year I have the privilege to be a Mac tech too! And you know what? It has been a lot EASIER, FUNNIER, more PRODUCTIVE and CHEAP too!!! Not for our company only but for those customers who switched to the Mac platform too! The Total Cost of Ownership is REALLY low when you buy and/or sell Macs wither you like it, believe it or not...

Of course M$ made Windows 2000 Pro/Server which as I said in other posts are the most stable OSes M$ ever built (XP let's just say that it has another 2 or 3 Service Packs to go so that it can be called stable, mature, etc.) but they had Apple and Linux community to be afraid of... Or ain't that so? Come on, we all know the truth of how M$ afraids Linux & Apple too!

Now regarding BSOD because you all seem NOT to get it, ask an IT manager of any given company how MANY dollars they throw to support their PCs and you will get it... Top dollars! Not just because of BSOD but because I said before the way that a Wintel PC chooses not to obey his master at random times and yes the problem is not solved by just reset the PC...

As for low quality parts that cause the crashes, etc I think IBM, HP, Dell, Compaq et al claim to have the BEST PC parts one can find on the market and STILL have problems with Windows... To me as Omni puts it, while they said the following only for M$ Office, methinks that it is true for Windows too: M$ put so many features into their programs with so many options, buttons, etc and that makes their programs unreliable, not funny and make the end user feel stupid and not the other way around! Come on guys, even M$ admits that their OSes and apps are too massive for programmers to solve problems easily... And you know what? If their software was that good, how come and they constantly discover bugs? Gimme a break: Windows 2000 family Service Pack 3 its 130 MEGA BYTES for crying out LOUD... SP2 was 100 MB... You know what? The first release of the Win2k family, the full CD was more like 400-450 MB!!!

Do you ANY of you think for real that Windows 2k and XP are that hot? Then how come NO company upgrades? Oh, I know: They wait when those OSes will be more mature... Or is it because companies afraid of falling victims of M$, again... And believe me, many companies start to realize that after all, M$ is not that good or any good at all... That's why Linux is on the rise as well as Mac OS X. Also, when I am talking of Apple I am not talking of Mac OS pre X times. No, I am talking of Mac OS X, which changed Apple for good from that niche company to one that sails for other seas, new ones or dare I say undiscovered ones?

As for a product which sells more therefore is the best product available or a company which is No.1 in its sector is No.1 overall, that's plain BS... Obviously you haven't heard about Amiga OS, Atari OS, Stacker, DR, Novell, Quarterdeck, Norton, BE, and many-many other companies and products which more or less demolished by M$ while those offered a lot better technologies... Back at OS/2 times we had a 32bit OS which could be run at 4MB with GUI on a 386/33 MHz, with so many functions that M$ copied with Win9x and even with Win2k and still that OS disappeared from the market... I bet that even Linux could not beat the OS/2 requirements while running a GUI!

So, back off, telling people around -and even worst, to yourselves- that M$ is the best out there because they are No.1 in the market, 'cause simply put that's a BIG lie, fellas...

Oh, and one other thing: The ones defending the PC always mention of stupid users who mess their machines and they are the ones to blame and not M$... Obviously you don't have an idea of how a real programming MUST be done or you are working for M$... You know what? The first rule of ANY given software is to make it in a way that a user will NOT be able to mess it THAT much so he/she will render it useless... While at the same time will be easy from him/her to use that software! In that area Apple succeeds more than M$ and that's why methinks in that the next version of Windows will resemble Mac OS X more than anything else...
As for which platform is the best: Maybe I am wrong on this, but I think it's the one with the apple logo on its products. Not just because I say so but because I NEVER saw a person use a Mac OS X machine and not wanted one... And you know why they choose a Wintel? Because of piracy, a lot less money needed to buy one and more games on Wintel... Not because they like Windows or M$ but because the Wintel platform have illegal copies EVERYWHERE, warez AND comes cheap too! So, there I said it... And for those who think otherwise can continue to think so but I know that deep inside them they REALLY envy a Dual G4/1.25 with Mac OS X more than ANY other Wintel box out there

Now if that Mac OS X box could run Kazaa, Morpheus, WinMX, et al too

Ain't life a beetch, PC and Mac fellas?

And for those who think that I am blind, I say to them that they may be right on the mark but I am in the privilege position of having both at my fingers. I use both. I HAVE to use both. I care for both. I want to use both. But in the end I enjoy the Mac a lot more... You know what? Maybe that's the way of me living like this: I am married to my wife for many years and I enjoy being with her just like the first days we met! In my path I had all those girls, women wanted to be with me but I rejected them (even for the one night thing) and still doing the same thing and will continue to do the same thing... Not because my wife is the most beautiful one or the smartest or the most educated of them all but because I simply love her because she is what she is and that's it!

 

[solrac]

That's all great hulkaros.

It's true that mac has less stupid options and is therefore easier and more stable, yet you can get exactly the same thing done.

It's true that mac is nicer and easier to use.

It's true that mac makes a system that a user can't ruinate. (Unless they sign in as root! HAHA)

But the only reason the mac is behind is because of games. That's IT.

There's equal piracy on mac. It's easier to steal mac software on ****** than it is to steal PC software on ***** and ****** actually.

There's equal utilities / software.

Now with OS X, there's equal database, server, ODBC, etc. etc. etc. Even more on the UNIX side.

The ONLY thing that separates the mac as inferior to PC is that it costs more money to have a fast system and not as many games.

In every other way the mac excels.

I just did a bunch of photoshop / web design work on my new PC.

Why? Cuz it's 1000000000x faster than my TiBook 400. My TiBook is molasses, even with 1 GB of RAM.

But the whole time I missed the mac, even though I have been using windows for years and have an objective viewpoint and not biased to mac.

Once all the games come out for mac at the same time as PCs, and knowledge about macs spreads to regular consumers, and not LIES, then the macs will start to take over, unless M$ makes an AWESOME OS but is that really gonna happen? I think not. Apple will be ahead for a long time.

 

[plastic]

Is taking vitamin C pills good for your body?

Gee, I think like the above question, health freaks will say yes, while those who are into organic foods will scream and press the panic button.

By now, I have a better understanding of the PC - Mac - Windoze (have to do this... habitual) - Unix - OS X - Linux and the rest of the computer world terminology (spell check?)

Guys, this is fast becoming a flame fest (Ed, I know I should not use this sensitive word, but I really hate to see this happening in here). And no, I don't own this joint. I am only a newbie guest here. Yes, a noob.

Conclusion (so far) :

Hardware - Good computers means expensive hardware.

OS - If you are good at setting up the OS on whatever platform you prefer, I guess it will be stable. (Except "OS E" on USS Enterprise in Star Trek). Heck, even Palm OS crashes!

So I shall keep my mouth SHUT and not comment anymore about what I prefer. I think I have said enough. There are people who prefer PCs and there are those, like me, who loves the Mac.

I remember a MS Engineer telling me once that : "Only retards use Macs because you cannot tweak them like Windows machine does."

I just mailed him OS X today.

 

[solrac]

Originally posted by plastic
I just mailed him OS X today.

Piracy anyone?

 

[uoba]

He could be a vendor sending it in the post? (help me out here plastic )

 

[plastic]

Ahem, I am a digital audio system integrater for Apple system. I have with me, three ORIGINAL Jaguars. And I am waiting for the first OS X enabled Logic Audio to come as well for testing purpose. I sent that dude a copy of Jaguar because I recently found out that he had bought for himself a TiBook! ha ha ha... a second hand 500 I think.

No, I do not support piracy. I compose music for NY company, peer music and I am suffering FIRST HAND from the effects of Napster.

Thank you.

 

[plastic]

Come to think about it, how many of you actually have the 10.1 CD packages? Remember the upgrade pack for 10.1.4? Anyone? I have only two sets with me, kicking myself for sending out eight copies. Gee... that was pretty dumb....

 

[Annihilatus]

Originally posted by hulkaros
Of course M$ made Windows 2000 Pro/Server which as I said in other posts are the most stable OSes M$ ever built (XP let's just say that it has another 2 or 3 Service Packs to go so that it can be called stable, mature, etc.) but they had Apple and Linux community to be afraid of... Or ain't that so? Come on, we all know the truth of how M$ afraids Linux & Apple too!

Every person, including myself, that has ever switched to Linux regretted it days later. Windows a much more friendly OS than Linux is and certain builds of Linux, like Mandrake, are so buggy and crash so often that you're better off just staying with Windows. As for XP itself needing a couple of service packs, I've always updated mine and it is extremely stable. My girlfriend never updates her version of XP and it's extremely stable. An old geezer that lives next to her that used to use a Mac and now uses a PC never updates and he too has never had stability issues. These are THREE regular people that don't have stability issues. I honestly think you're lying about being a PC technician.

Now regarding BSOD because you all seem NOT to get it, ask an IT manager of any given company how MANY dollars they throw to support their PCs and you will get it... Top dollars! Not just because of BSOD but because I said before the way that a Wintel PC chooses not to obey his master at random times and yes the problem is not solved by just reset the PC...

Well with all of the viruses made for the PC, it's rather normal that there would have to be a lot of support for PC computers. The same way there are complete morons using a Mac, there are morons using a PC and these are the geniuses that click on every attachment of every email they ever get. They also willingly sign up to every spam list and then complain about it. Knowing their stupidity, you would understand why IT would need so much money to cover up the holes they made. Replace all of those PC's with Macs and you'll have the same amount of stupid people regardless. Replace the market share of the PC with that of the Mac and more people will write viruses on the Mac for those stupid people to get infected with. The ONLY reason there are 'no security issues' with Macs as untrue as that is is because no geek is willing to bother destroying a Mac (most PC people will say that using a Mac is a pain in itself). Virus writers, who want their virus to be as popular as possible, don't see the point of infecting as little people as possible. Finally, ask hackers (not Mac users) what's easier to hack, Windows or Unix, and the real hackers will tell you that it's a lot easier getting into a Unix machine than a Windows machine. You'll all disagree, but you're all biased too.

As for low quality parts that cause the crashes, etc I think IBM, HP, Dell, Compaq et al claim to have the BEST PC parts one can find on the market and STILL have problems with Windows... To me as Omni puts it, while they said the following only for M$ Office, methinks that it is true for Windows too: M$ put so many features into their programs with so many options, buttons, etc and that makes their programs unreliable, not funny and make the end user feel stupid and not the other way around! Come on guys, even M$ admits that their OSes and apps are too massive for programmers to solve problems easily... And you know what? If their software was that good, how come and they constantly discover bugs? Gimme a break: Windows 2000 family Service Pack 3 its 130 MEGA BYTES for crying out LOUD... SP2 was 100 MB... You know what? The first release of the Win2k family, the full CD was more like 400-450 MB!!!

Let's be logical here for a second and put ourselves in the average consumer's shoes. A new version of Windows is released. Model A is a Windows version with the same sh*t but more secure and stable. Model B is a Windows version with an improved, nicer interface and extra features. Which of the two models will sell out? Why would MS choose Model B knowing that it will sell out? Assuming that aesthetics are the most important thing for a Mac user (since just about every thread here is focused on talking about how much prettier Mac OS X is and how Macs look nicer), MS knows that every consumer, even Mac users, would take model B. MS is a company, it wants to make money. It'll focus on what consumers want FIRST, cover up the rest after. No average consumer would pay 200$ for extra security. As for IBM, HP, Compaq and what not having the best quality hardware, if you are indeed a PC technician then you should know this to be false. Those companies put an integrated video card, audio card and modem, as well as an integrated network card. Whatever costs them the least and allows them to profit the most. NO OEM COMPANY, NOT EVEN APPLE, PUTS HARDWARE IN THEIR MACHINES THAT'S HIGH-QUALITY. If you want such a thing, you build the computer yourself. Again, if you're a PC technician and I know that you are not, you'll know that HSF modems, SiS audio, network and graphics chipsets don't allow you to do much. That's hardly high-quality.

Do you ANY of you think for real that Windows 2k and XP are that hot? Then how come NO company upgrades? Oh, I know: They wait when those OSes will be more mature... Or is it because companies afraid of falling victims of M$, again... And believe me, many companies start to realize that after all, M$ is not that good or any good at all... That's why Linux is on the rise as well as Mac OS X. Also, when I am talking of Apple I am not talking of Mac OS pre X times. No, I am talking of Mac OS X, which changed Apple for good from that niche company to one that sails for other seas, new ones or dare I say undiscovered ones?

Neither Linux nor Mac OS X is on the rise according to market stats, you're basically making up stuff as you go along. AS for companies not upgrading, you have to consider how much upgrading costs. Even if MS made the greatest OS tomorrow, companies would be satisfied with their previous offering and would stick to it until it's absolutely obselete. Think of NT4. The OS sucks IMO, but companies (even mine) are sticking to it because it works well enough. 2000 and XP are way better, but why pay a couple of thousand to get a nicer interface that does the same thing. Maybe as a Mac user you're used to spending massive amounts of money so that Photoshop loads a second quicker or iTunes plays a visualization smoother, but any consumer with a brain won't.

As for a product which sells more therefore is the best product available or a company which is No.1 in its sector is No.1 overall, that's plain BS... Obviously you haven't heard about Amiga OS, Atari OS, Stacker, DR, Novell, Quarterdeck, Norton, BE, and many-many other companies and products which more or less demolished by M$ while those offered a lot better technologies... Back at OS/2 times we had a 32bit OS which could be run at 4MB with GUI on a 386/33 MHz, with so many functions that M$ copied with Win9x and even with Win2k and still that OS disappeared from the market... I bet that even Linux could not beat the OS/2 requirements while running a GUI!

Actually I've heard of all those OS's. I still think that AMiga and Atari should have been where the PC and Mac are and PC and Mac should have died. However, that's not the case. OS/2 btw was a product that at its very beginning was created by MS. What was to become OS/2 when MS and IBM drifted apart became NT. To say though that OS/2 would run on a 386-33 wih 4 megs, while technically true in that it RUNS, it is such a painful experience that even people who don't understand DOS would want to go back to it. Since you're such an expert though, I'd like for you to at least mention a couple of things that MS copied from OS/2. It should be interesting to see how much bullsh*t you come up with.

So, back off, telling people around -and even worst, to yourselves- that M$ is the best out there because they are No.1 in the market, 'cause simply put that's a BIG lie, fellas...

I still think Word is the best word processing program and I still think Windows has the most easy to use interface I've ever used. In my opinion, they ARE the best. In a matter of moments though, my opinion will get a lot of responses from trolls.

Andre

 

[Annihilatus]

Originally posted by solrac
It's true that mac makes a system that a user can't ruinate. (Unless they sign in as root! HAHA)

I'm not sure whether you meant ruin or urinate. I assure you though that any consumer with enough willpower can learn to urinate on his Mac. And he won't need root access for it.

But the only reason the mac is behind is because of games. That's IT.

That's an opinion but I will go further and to tell you that the reason people aren't buying Macs is because their friends don't have it. The same thing that will push a person to use MSN Messenger over ICQ or AIM is what will push them to buy a PC over a Mac. The conversation is always the same: I'd like to contact you, do you have an ICQ number? -- No I use MSN messenger. The result is the person gets MSN messenger. The more people respond that they have MSN, the more likely that will be his choice. If your friend tells you that if you buy a PC, he'll copy all of his games for you, the likelihood is that you'll buy a PC to play games with him. Let's say you're a hockey fan and want to play NHL over a network, even if the Mac and PC copies of the game are fully compatible, regular people don't know that and will try to get a computer that's as similar as possible to their friends'. As a result, people buy PC's.

The ONLY thing that separates the mac as inferior to PC is that it costs more money to have a fast system and not as many games.

Paying 2000$ more for a system that's 2x as slow is definitely a factor, I agree.

Andre

 

[Annihilatus]

Originally posted by plastic
Ahem, I am a digital audio system integrater for Apple system. I have with me, three ORIGINAL Jaguars. And I am waiting for the first OS X enabled Logic Audio to come as well for testing purpose. I sent that dude a copy of Jaguar because I recently found out that he had bought for himself a TiBook! ha ha ha... a second hand 500 I think.

No, I do not support piracy. I compose music for NY company, peer music and I am suffering FIRST HAND from the effects of Napster.

This after extensive research has been done disproving that file-swapping has any effect on the purchase of music. Good job.

Andre

 

[solrac]

Originally posted by Annihilatus


I'm not sure whether you meant ruin or urinate. I assure you though that any consumer with enough willpower can learn to urinate on his Mac. And he won't need root access for it.

hey, ruinate is a word.

That's an opinion but I will go further and to tell you that the reason people aren't buying Macs is because their friends don't have it. The same thing that will push a person to use MSN Messenger over ICQ or AIM is what will push them to buy a PC over a Mac. The conversation is always the same: I'd like to contact you, do you have an ICQ number? -- No I use MSN messenger. The result is the person gets MSN messenger. The more people respond that they have MSN, the more likely that will be his choice. If your friend tells you that if you buy a PC, he'll copy all of his games for you, the likelihood is that you'll buy a PC to play games with him. Let's say you're a hockey fan and want to play NHL over a network, even if the Mac and PC copies of the game are fully compatible, regular people don't know that and will try to get a computer that's as similar as possible to their friends'. As a result, people buy PC's.

exactly. Which just boils back down to macs don't have games. Everyone's friend has a PC because the games are on it.

If the mac had all the games too, and sufficient time for consumer knowledge to spread that a mac game is fully compatible with a PC game (locally or on the network), then it wouldn't matter what your friends have. PC or Mac can communicate on the internet, has the same software, has all the games.

It is the lack of games that will turn away the largest percentage of consumers. Even a business man who just needs to use excel, could TOTALLY get a mac. But just because his kid wants to play counterstrike, he'll get a PC.

Paying 2000$ more for a system that's 2x as slow is definitely a factor, I agree.

Andre

Well that's a bit of exaggeration. More like $1000 more for a system that's 0.5 times as slow, yet twice as productive in software.

And if you say that windows is the easiest interface you've ever used, out of people who have used both mac and windows extensively (or even casually) then you are in a very unique group.

Maybe you're left-brained?

 

[hulkaros]

Originally posted by Annihilatus


Every person, including myself, that has ever switched to Linux regretted it days later. Windows a much more friendly OS than Linux is and certain builds of Linux, like Mandrake, are so buggy and crash so often that you're better off just staying with Windows. As for XP itself needing a couple of service packs, I've always updated mine and it is extremely stable. My girlfriend never updates her version of XP and it's extremely stable. An old geezer that lives next to her that used to use a Mac and now uses a PC never updates and he too has never had stability issues. These are THREE regular people that don't have stability issues. I honestly think you're lying about being a PC technician.

Andre

Look Anni-what? You win! You know everything and you and you other 2 or 3 friends are correct on every account. M$ is the best software/hardware company out there.

And yes you found out the truth: I am not a PC technician. But, I am a PC AND a Mac technician wither you like it or not... Believe it or not...

As for trolls and biased people on this forum, take the following steps:
-Get up
-Go in front of a mirror
-Look at yourself
-Take a good hard look and realize the truth...

You see? It wasn't that hard...

 

[plastic]

I could not touch the screen as I was reading this thread... all these flaming is making this thread too hot! Gee guys... cool off a little will ya? Please?

On the topic of extensive research, well, that is another topic altogether. Maybe we can have a flame war, composers in music losing 60% of income since iTunes came about... ha ha ha... nevermind... I had a good talk with someone from BMG (the dudes who shut Napster down initially)... and the figures were scary... ha ha ha... now the record companies are flooding the servers with rubbish and viruses. Which is scary. They are stooping so low to kill what they cannot control. I cannot totally agree with what they are doing to save income. But nevertheless, I do not support piracy.

Think about the poor dude who wrote a really good program and we simply rip them off, using it and not paying for it... gee... that dude has to pay bills and eat too right?

OK, enough of preaching.

Everyone do what you have to do. I was here asking everyone to turn the gas down feeding the flames... it is getting too hot in here. I blame the weather...

 

[mmilano]

hulkaros: pretty rightous speech there loaded with opinion and presented as fact. but i can respect that. i just want to comment on a few things.

PC rulez! Ok?

here we are off to a bad start. i read your entire post and you are talking about windows in this paragraph. you clearly acknowledge linux below, but you are not counting for the fact that linux and every other flavor of unix runs on pcs except for os x.

"PC rulez! Ok? No, I really mean this... They rule the world for real! And then comes Hulkaros and tries to defend a crappy OS by the name of Mac OS X and all of a sudden he and that OS are BS!

Personal experience friends not with one PC, not two, not even a thousand.... "

-- well i read that a few times and could not make much sense of it. maybe you are defending os x? i don't think anyone is knocking it. it is a great os.

Not for our company only but for those customers who switched to the Mac platform too! The Total Cost of Ownership is REALLY low when you buy and/or sell Macs wither you like it, believe it or not...

it's obvious you are not supporting a corporate environment, and you are working with consumers who probably use macs at home. you are entitled to your opinion about price, but in my opinion you are way off. i've had the same pc running win2k for over a year now that has not costed me over $800 that i spent the day i purchased it. my other pc that i purchased since then has not costed me more money either... and while i'm at it, neither has my mac.

Of course M$ made Windows 2000 Pro/Server which as I said in other posts are the most stable OSes M$ ever built (XP let's just say that it has another 2 or 3 Service Packs to go so that it can be called stable, mature, etc.) but they had Apple and Linux community to be afraid of... Or ain't that so? Come on, we all know the truth of how M$ afraids Linux & Apple too!

that is the most truth i've read in your entire post.

Now regarding BSOD because you all seem NOT to get it, ask an IT manager of any given company how MANY dollars they throw to support their PCs and you will get it... Top dollars! Not just because of BSOD but because I said before the way that a Wintel PC chooses not to obey his master at random times and yes the problem is not solved by just reset the PC...

uhh.. how many companies use macs for their entire network? i work for a company in the media industry, and we a macs, but they are used primarily for media and the few who work remote as they chose titanium laptops. i'm just saying you can't ask an IT manager because most of them are dealing with pc's running windows in a corporate environment. if they were working with macs, certainly they would be working with older macs too which beleive it or not, they have their own problems too as i've seen quite a few times at my own job.

Do you ANY of you think for real that Windows 2k and XP are that hot? Then how come NO company upgrades?

sorry buddy, "you're wrong". my corporation has upgraded, and all new systems are xp. even though i wish they just kept win2k. i know several companies who use current ms os' too. but remember now, we are not talking about corporate networks.. that is not a fair comparisant because how many corporations us os x?

I bet that even Linux could not beat the OS/2 requirements while running a GUI!

you should really know what you are talking about before you start talking about linux. "linux" is such a gereral term and there are many distros. i can tell by that statment that you haven't seen more than maybe 1 version.

So, back off, telling people around -and even worst, to yourselves- that M$ is the best out there because they are No.1 in the market, 'cause simply put that's a BIG lie, fellas...

wtf are you talking about? if you read this post more carefully, i think people educating the blind who keep saying "pc's suck" that ms isn't as bad as they say. even i think that osx is way more beautiful than any windows product, and of course unix is extremely more robust.. but i can acknowledge that "pc's" in general don't suck, and i can distinguish the difference between pc's and windows when i'm conversing.

Oh, and one other thing: The ones defending the PC always mention of stupid users who mess their machines and they are the ones to blame and not M$... Obviously you don't have an idea of how a real programming MUST be done or you are working for M$...

by far one of the lamest things you've said. i can open up my terminal in os x as root and type "rm -rf *" and screw up a lotta sh*t. there are tons of other ways too. now what about the people who are programmers? what about users who are power users? i can get into osx and screw up plenty of crap, and i don't blame programmers for that, it is a feature. when users mess up windows, they are usually messing with system settings or files just like how i could screw up os x. besides i believe only 1 person here used that as an example. you exaggerate.

And for those who think that I am blind, I say to them that they may be right on the mark but I am in the privilege position of having both at my fingers. I use both. I HAVE to use both. I care for both. I want to use both.

yeah, your post is kinda blind. i use both and care for both too. i can appreciate my mac for what it is.. i can appreciate my pcs for what they are.

if you read this entire post more carefully, .. you might notice no one is saying that MS is the best as you are portraying. they are more defending the ignorant remarks that pc's suck and so on.

i hope i don't seem like i'm trying to talk down to people. that is sorta the vibe i got from your post .. although you are interpretting the others you are speaking at wrong. i just want to preset all this for intelligent discussion without emotions or mactosterone involved.

 

[Annihilatus]

Originally posted by solrac

hey, ruinate is a word.

Yes, an adjective. Not a verb.

exactly. Which just boils back down to macs don't have games. Everyone's friend has a PC because the games are on it.

If the mac had all the games too, and sufficient time for consumer knowledge to spread that a mac game is fully compatible with a PC game (locally or on the network), then it wouldn't matter what your friends have. PC or Mac can communicate on the internet, has the same software, has all the games.

It is the lack of games that will turn away the largest percentage of consumers. Even a business man who just needs to use excel, could TOTALLY get a mac. But just because his kid wants to play counterstrike, he'll get a PC.

Exactly. But let's not forget that even if one game is available on the Mac, not all of them are. You'll get big-name games like Quake or Diablo, but you won't get a lot of newcomers until a year or two later. The PC platform is where game companies WANT to release their games first becuase if their small, budget game becomes a success, it will make a couple of million instead of a couple of thousand. Let's say for instance I get a team of programmers and make a game called Leapin' Lanny in the Land of the Lovely Ladies and it becomes a hit, if I've released that game for the PC, I can make money from my budget game. If I release it for the Mac, I won't. Because if only 10% of all PC users buy my game, I'll have a few million sales. If 10% of all Mac users buy my game, I probably won't even cut a profit.

Well that's a bit of exaggeration. More like $1000 more for a system that's 0.5 times as slow, yet twice as productive in software.

Saying it's more productive is a lie. Mac users will come up with a new reason to switch to Mac every time a PC outdoes them in a field. At first it was the GUI. Once PC got that it was the spped. Once PC got sufficiently fast, it was the stability. Once Windows became stable, they started talking about how productive it is. What determines the productivity of a computer? Will the computer determine that or will the user determine that? Currently, my PC with all of the software I have does way more than a Mac. Therefore my PC is more productive. Plus it costs some 2000$ less than a Mac with most of the software not even available. A computer is not productive, a person is productive. If you're lazy, the Mac won't make you active.

And if you say that windows is the easiest interface you've ever used, out of people who have used both mac and windows extensively (or even casually) then you are in a very unique group.

What's so hard to understand about Windows? Currently loaded programs are at the bottom, currently loaded service are in the tray. All the programs available are in the start menu and if I think something is running, I can do CTRL-ALT-DEL and see what's in memory? It's simply, it's organized and frankly it's organized. If I find that copying files through the GUI is a pain, I can go into DOS and use a command like COPY BITCH*.* C:\REAL and it'll copy any files in a directory that begins with BITCH into the REAL directory. That's simplicity for me.

Maybe it's the 146 IQ.

 

[Annihilatus]

Originally posted by hulkaros

Look Anni-what? You win! You know everything and you and you other 2 or 3 friends are correct on every account. M$ is the best software/hardware company out there.

As long as you can admit it, all is well. Acknowledging it is the first step to accepting it.

And yes you found out the truth: I am not a PC technician. But, I am a PC AND a Mac technician wither you like it or not... Believe it or not...

Then you must be a freelance technician because I can't see how anyone would want to hire someone who creates as much false information and assumes so many false things as you do.

As for trolls and biased people on this forum, take the following steps:
-Get up
-Go in front of a mirror
-Look at yourself
-Take a good hard look and realize the truth...

Honestly, when I look in the mirror, I see a good looking guy who doesn't like to be fed assumptions, rumours and beliefs but rather real information. I don't see how you can call me a troll for defending my platform with truth rather than the BS you like to defend yours with.