X-Windows?
- Thread starter AppMan
- Start date
RacerX
Old Rhapsody User
Most Mac users? No, not really. If you use your Mac at home this really doesn't effect you that much.
Apple's X11 is a way of getting into the professional Unix market. For a large number of businesses Linux on a PC is just not going to cut it, so they are still using mid to high end Unix workstations from places like Sun Microsystems, IBM, HP and SGI. When you consider that the low end workstations start in the neighborhood of about $9000 and go up from there, Apple's top of the line PowerMac G4 is quite a deal. Add to that the fact that Apple makes laptop systems (which other venders don't), and Apple has a nice way to work themselves into the market.
Up to now the only thing Apple was missing was an Apple supported X Windows solution (that could take advantage of many things that Mac OS X has to offer). When Apple finally releases a stable 1.0 version of X11, they should be in the perfect position to enter into workflows that would never have considered a Mac before (and had rejected Linux/PC solutions in the past).
Apple's X11 is a way of getting into the professional Unix market. For a large number of businesses Linux on a PC is just not going to cut it, so they are still using mid to high end Unix workstations from places like Sun Microsystems, IBM, HP and SGI. When you consider that the low end workstations start in the neighborhood of about $9000 and go up from there, Apple's top of the line PowerMac G4 is quite a deal. Add to that the fact that Apple makes laptop systems (which other venders don't), and Apple has a nice way to work themselves into the market.
Up to now the only thing Apple was missing was an Apple supported X Windows solution (that could take advantage of many things that Mac OS X has to offer). When Apple finally releases a stable 1.0 version of X11, they should be in the perfect position to enter into workflows that would never have considered a Mac before (and had rejected Linux/PC solutions in the past).
Ripcord
Senior Lurker
This is also another way to make cross-platform development a bit easier in the consumer space. As desktop Linux grows in popularity, for example (which it's poised to start doing pretty substantially in 2003 & 2004), this helps position OS X better - it will be much easier to port apps generally targeted for Linux.
RacerX
Old Rhapsody User
Seems to me Linux has been poised to start it's growth as a desktop solution for consumers every year since 1998. Actually I thought 2000/2001 would have been it's break out years... unfortunately those years saw the end of some of the best developers the platform had ever had (I personally morned the loss of Eazel back in May of 2001).
I'll be very happy if it is true, but I've seen nothing from Linux that makes it any more of a consumer choice now than at any point in time in the last 5 years.
I'll be very happy if it is true, but I've seen nothing from Linux that makes it any more of a consumer choice now than at any point in time in the last 5 years.
Ripcord
Senior Lurker
Don't want to start a Linux war, especially on a Mac board =), so I won't. But just to respond a bit:
I do remember reading articles in 1998, 1999, etc discussing how Linux would soon become a "force" on the desktop. However, at no point, until recently, have I felt that this might be true.
However, there are a lot of things that have been coming together to make 2003/2004 look promising for the arrival of desktop Linux:
- Linux's success in the server market have finally started to provide it respect as a "serious" OS, not just a hobby or OS for geeks
- Development in a wide range of areas is finally paying off towards desktop maturity, i.e. hardware support (I'm starting to see vendors going out of their way to mention Linux driver support, for example), overall GUI (a la KDE and Gnome), mature, stable apps (I'm loving Mozilla lately, and KOffice/Openoffice are actually productive), distributions with a desktop-focus (i.e. Redhat 8, LindowsOS, etc). Overall the technology is finally getting pretty close.
- Wide corporate support. IBM's major Linux focus was a huge plus, but vendors like Sun, HP, Dell, etc are investing some serious resources in Linux and related technologies, and have a vested interest in seeing them succeed. This has really been boosting momentum. (Even Sun is supposed to release a desktop-oriented Linux distro later this year, which could have some serious impact on the industry. Then again, we've all heard this kind of thing before =)
- I could go on, but nobody reads my 4-page posts =)
I don't think we'll really start seeing Linux in the home anytime in the near future (despite companies like Wal-Mart, Dabs, and others marketing home-oriented Linux PCs). Instead, I'm expecting to see Linux start to become a real player in the Workstation market, an area where it has almost no presence today.
And good luck to them. I'm not a big Linux user, myself, I find Windows and Mac OSX infinitely more productive. But anything that helps break the Windows stranglehold is a Good Thing (not that I have anything against MS, either, I just think 95% dominance isn't healthy), and it will be (relatively) very easy to port apps between Linux and OS X, which is also a Good Thing. =)
I do remember reading articles in 1998, 1999, etc discussing how Linux would soon become a "force" on the desktop. However, at no point, until recently, have I felt that this might be true.
However, there are a lot of things that have been coming together to make 2003/2004 look promising for the arrival of desktop Linux:
- Linux's success in the server market have finally started to provide it respect as a "serious" OS, not just a hobby or OS for geeks
- Development in a wide range of areas is finally paying off towards desktop maturity, i.e. hardware support (I'm starting to see vendors going out of their way to mention Linux driver support, for example), overall GUI (a la KDE and Gnome), mature, stable apps (I'm loving Mozilla lately, and KOffice/Openoffice are actually productive), distributions with a desktop-focus (i.e. Redhat 8, LindowsOS, etc). Overall the technology is finally getting pretty close.
- Wide corporate support. IBM's major Linux focus was a huge plus, but vendors like Sun, HP, Dell, etc are investing some serious resources in Linux and related technologies, and have a vested interest in seeing them succeed. This has really been boosting momentum. (Even Sun is supposed to release a desktop-oriented Linux distro later this year, which could have some serious impact on the industry. Then again, we've all heard this kind of thing before =)
- I could go on, but nobody reads my 4-page posts =)
I don't think we'll really start seeing Linux in the home anytime in the near future (despite companies like Wal-Mart, Dabs, and others marketing home-oriented Linux PCs). Instead, I'm expecting to see Linux start to become a real player in the Workstation market, an area where it has almost no presence today.
And good luck to them. I'm not a big Linux user, myself, I find Windows and Mac OSX infinitely more productive. But anything that helps break the Windows stranglehold is a Good Thing (not that I have anything against MS, either, I just think 95% dominance isn't healthy), and it will be (relatively) very easy to port apps between Linux and OS X, which is also a Good Thing. =)
ex2bot
Registered Bot
Okay. . .
My memory is fuzzy on what I did exactly to install it.
First I installed X11. That ran with no problem. Then I downloaded OpenOffice and unstuffed it. Next, I ran the script that was provided (I think) and (I think) it let me select my X11 implementation.
Then, run X11, select the 'Application' menu, then 'Customize', then put in the path to OpenOffice.
OpenOffice should show up on the 'Application' menu. You should be able to selct and run it.
It seems to run really well, althought it seems a bit sluggish on my flat-panel iMac.
** I need to go home and check to make sure I gave you the correct advice. I don't have OpenOffice/X11 here on my iBook.**
Doug
My memory is fuzzy on what I did exactly to install it.
First I installed X11. That ran with no problem. Then I downloaded OpenOffice and unstuffed it. Next, I ran the script that was provided (I think) and (I think) it let me select my X11 implementation.
Then, run X11, select the 'Application' menu, then 'Customize', then put in the path to OpenOffice.
OpenOffice should show up on the 'Application' menu. You should be able to selct and run it.
It seems to run really well, althought it seems a bit sluggish on my flat-panel iMac.
** I need to go home and check to make sure I gave you the correct advice. I don't have OpenOffice/X11 here on my iBook.**
Doug
ex2bot
Registered Bot
Good directions for getting OpenOffice to run at: http://porting.openoffice.org/mac/
Notes:
Get and install Apple's X11. (should be easy)
Get and unstuff OpenOffice.org1.0.1 beta for OS X.
Run X11.
Add OpenOffice to the X11 Applications menu.
Select OpenOffice from the apps menu to run it.
At that point you're set.
By the way, the readme mentions that Ghostscript (and a few other programs) are required, but they are included and automatically installed.
Let me know if you have problems. It seems like a nice app.
Doug
Notes:
Get and install Apple's X11. (should be easy)
Get and unstuff OpenOffice.org1.0.1 beta for OS X.
Run X11.
Add OpenOffice to the X11 Applications menu.
Select OpenOffice from the apps menu to run it.
At that point you're set.
By the way, the readme mentions that Ghostscript (and a few other programs) are required, but they are included and automatically installed.
Let me know if you have problems. It seems like a nice app.
Doug
djliquidice
Registered
Would it be correct to say:
X11 (For OSX) only runs apps written for X.
Mac apps do not run on X.
X11 (For OSX) only runs apps written for X.
Mac apps do not run on X.
Ripcord
Senior Lurker
Well, if you want to get REALLY picky, you could say something like, "the X11R6.6 server for OS X only displays X client apps. Mac Aqua applications do not attempt to contact or interface with X servers". But most people would probably stop listening after you said "X11R6.6".
mr. k
Registered
does anyone know how to make fink work with x11? I have x11 installed and it works just fine but when I try and dl an app with fink, fink says something like 'get apples x11 or xfree-86's XonX window system and then the package doesnt even download? Has anyone got something like this too work?
ex2bot
Registered Bot
Jove,
I'm going to assume that you have Apple's X11 installed, and that you got it to run. (If not, let me know.)
Download and unstuff our mount the OpenOffice download. I don't remember if it is a .SIT (a Stuffit compressed file) or a .DMG or .IMG file (a disk image). If you are confused about this part, let me know.
Make sure you know where all the files are for Open Office; they will either be extracted to a folder inside your download folder or they will be in one of those white virtual volumes that pop up in Finder when they're mounted. Are you with me so far? ** Please let me know. **
[Now I need to go home and re-install it so I can make sure that I know what I'm talking about.]
I'll post another message later tonight. . .
I'm going to assume that you have Apple's X11 installed, and that you got it to run. (If not, let me know.)
Download and unstuff our mount the OpenOffice download. I don't remember if it is a .SIT (a Stuffit compressed file) or a .DMG or .IMG file (a disk image). If you are confused about this part, let me know.
Make sure you know where all the files are for Open Office; they will either be extracted to a folder inside your download folder or they will be in one of those white virtual volumes that pop up in Finder when they're mounted. Are you with me so far? ** Please let me know. **
[Now I need to go home and re-install it so I can make sure that I know what I'm talking about.]
I'll post another message later tonight. . .
mr. k
Registered
On the fink.sourceforge.com page it says to get fink to work right you need to install X11 with the X11 SDK and then download system-xfree86 and fink it. Is this right? And where to I get the X11 SDK? I cant find it anywhere on apples site or the developer site. Also one off topic q... Where do you get applescript studio? I cant find it in my /Developer, it isnt there and apple says that it should come with the download ( I have the latest one ). Any help would be great!
-thanks
-thanks
wtmcgee
Registered
if you're a linux/unix user and haven't used fink ( http://fink.sourceforget.net ) you really should check it out.
ex2bot
Registered Bot
Jove,
By the way, the filename of OpenOffice is ooo101darwinfinalbeta.dmg
You don't need to configure a window manager. Apple's X11 uses the Quartz window manager. It comes pre-configured. **You don't need to run a script. I was wrong on that part.
TO INSTALL:
I reinstalled it to watch the installation again. It's simple, really! You'll find ooo101darwinfinalbeta.dmg wherever your Internet browser stores downloads. Install it by double-clicking on its icon.
Click okay to the pop up messages about needing to be Unix savvy and about the Applescripts failing to work. Ignore all that.
It should finish, indicating that installation was successful.
At that point, launch Apple's X11. Select the 'Applications' menu and 'Customize'.
Select 'Add Item'. Double-click in the highlighted area under 'Name' in the table and type in 'OpenOffice'. Tab to the next column and type:
/Applications/OpenOffice.org1.0.1/program/soffice
Now, to run OpenOffice, you only need open X11, then select OpenOffice from the Applications menu.
Let me know how it works.
By the way, the filename of OpenOffice is ooo101darwinfinalbeta.dmg
You don't need to configure a window manager. Apple's X11 uses the Quartz window manager. It comes pre-configured. **You don't need to run a script. I was wrong on that part.
TO INSTALL:
I reinstalled it to watch the installation again. It's simple, really! You'll find ooo101darwinfinalbeta.dmg wherever your Internet browser stores downloads. Install it by double-clicking on its icon.
Click okay to the pop up messages about needing to be Unix savvy and about the Applescripts failing to work. Ignore all that.
It should finish, indicating that installation was successful.
At that point, launch Apple's X11. Select the 'Applications' menu and 'Customize'.
Select 'Add Item'. Double-click in the highlighted area under 'Name' in the table and type in 'OpenOffice'. Tab to the next column and type:
/Applications/OpenOffice.org1.0.1/program/soffice
Now, to run OpenOffice, you only need open X11, then select OpenOffice from the Applications menu.
Let me know how it works.