Ding-Dong the Witch is dead!! IE no more!

qwikstreet

OS X Friendly
I could care less to see IE go the way of the dinosaurs. As it follows the piss poor Front Page import they once made.

IE was a huge resource hog and it would of only gotten worse once IE intergrated tabs into the browser. There are many other options out their to use for a browser or any other app M$ makes for Apple. I, personally, have slowly pushed out my need for M$. I even had M$ on my work PC in minimal states.

One theory I have on the stoppage of IE is that they don't wan't to develop their browser to run in an open source environment. Maybe they don't want some brainiac hack it up and make a version for Linux.
 

pds

Registered
Originally posted by qwikstreet
One theory I have on the stoppage of IE is that they don't wan't to develop their browser to run in an open source environment. Maybe they don't want some brainiac hack it up and make a version for Linux.

The building of the browser into the OS seems to me to be dangerous to computer users everywhere - connected with the Trusted Computer Group and the Fritz chip. Many people have serious misgivings of the control that MS or anyone with the keys will have over all sorts of data. (<www.gnu.org/philosophy/can-you-trust.html>)

With the preeminent browser (by sheer numbers) integrated into a system built on DRM technology, it may become harder for non MS machines to access all sites, more hassle for the common user, more reason to go with the flow.
 

Tarambana

Registered
Pyroboy:

Don't really worry, no nail, no coffin as of yet :)

First, IE is also not going to be developed any further on the Window$ platform. It is not as if M$ would drop their Macbu unit: they are just focusing on MSN as their web explorer. I guess it's got to do with their project of focusing of applications that would work per pay (like the pay per view business model), and which is also prepared (or looks like it is) for MS Office 2003 for PCs, which would need to pay a monthly fee for its online services.

Therefore, it's got nothing to do with Apple, but with M$'s own coffin: I really believe they won't be able to get through with that projects. At least, I would never pay a monthly or annual fee for being able to use a software program such a web explorer or a word processor.

Oh, and I don't know if it is true, but I think it has been rumored that Safari will go Gold Master by this month

:)
 

pyroboy

Registered
Oh...joy.

I have read that (I didn't include it in my rant) but the perception that MS is abandoning Apple is still a possibility if ignorant asses want to make an issue out of it.

As someone who develops Web sites, I will always use the MS Browser because that's the nav experience most of the people visiting my sites use.

I use Microsoft products every day to get things done. I use Excel because it is a very useful tool that does stuff Works will never do. The same with Word. If Microsoft abandons the Mac platform, I'm going to need to have more Windows stuff in my life and I'd rather not deal with that.
 

uoba

Re: member
It really is no deal concerning test standards on IE Mac version, the argument: 96% of world use IE, means the Windows version. As someone has rightly pointed out, the Mac version might as well be a totally different product with a different name compared to the Windows version!

There has never ever been any transparency between Mac IE and Windows IE (v5 upwards).

Microsoft could not possibly fit their business model for IE for Windows into the Mac world anyway. Again, some one else has pointed out that Microsoft cannot gain access system-level wise (as Apple obviously can). Plus, Mac users just do not fit the bill when it comes to those types of services: heightened advertising (see Messenger), regularly paid supscription services (the way the .Net ideal will be/is), and the integration which is all of the Microsoft products being indespensible to one another.
 

malexgreen

Contributor and PB User
Hopefully MS won't decide to not support improvments to Windows Media Player or MSN Messanger for MacOSX. I think that the ROI argument for IE applies as well to these applications, although these will have a more negative impact on Apple than Microsoft. If Apple comes out with a Quicktime that can run WMV, WMA, and an ichat that can talk to MSN Messanger users, then this will happen.

I hope Apple takes what just happened to heart if they are planning an iOffice. Things will get a little dirtier for them if MS decides to dump support for Office X if Apple competes with them in the office applications space.
 

Zarembo

Contributing member
Hey, I use M$ Internet Explorer and Windows Media Player because I must have the ability to access certain streaming radio stations.

Safari, although I think it is great, won't and can't access certain necessary information. And Safari, isn't ready for prime time just yet, there are too many sites which are incompatible with it.

I hope I don't lose the ability to listen to Windows Media Player and that Apple will build the capability to decipher WMP before M$FT eliminates IE. If not, I'm toast and will need to listen to streams on a crappy Wintel machine,

Isn't it amazing that Realplayer and WMP actually play better on a Mac than on a PC?
 

Pengu

Digital Music Pimp
"Losing" IE, is i think no big loss. Because we aren't losing anything. When was the last time it was updated? Just because they won't make new versions, doesn't mean the silly people using it have to stop. And as for MSN & WMP, There are soooo many third-party IM clients that it's a non issue. And if they want to start charging people to use MSN, they won't drop support, they'll just slow down development and charge people the same price for a 2 1/2 year old program. As for WMP. MS will keep WMP Mac for the same reason Apple Keeps Win32 Quicktime. To be able to say its compatible. And. As someone said. VLC plays WMP files, and it doesn't do that stupid "buffering" thing when its reading a LOCAL file.
 

adambyte

Registered
Ba-dumb-ching!

Hey, people of the Wiccan religion consider themselves "witches." Isn't that song just plain mean to witches?

It's been a while since I visited any site that ONLY worked in IE, and not in Mozilla, Camino, OmniWeb, or Safari. Hopefully the number of MSIE-only sites will dwindle and web-masters discover that there are a significant number of people using Linux and Mac OS X.

R.I.P. M.S.I.E. You will be-.... eh, who am I kidding? *pops open bottle of Martinelli's sparkling cider*
 

Arden

Where mah "any" keys at?
The two software applications that basically keep the Macintosh platform alive: Adobe Photoshop and Microsoft Word. Without these two applications, the Mac platform would be nowhere near as big as it is (which still isn't big enough; now, 15-25% marketshare would be absolutely delightful).

I think, even if Microsoft stops adding features and whatever to its browsers, they should at least release updates that add compatibility for new coding features and web standards. They could really go far to add capabilities for stuff like CSS3 (when it is finally finalized) and dynamic visual effects.
Originally posted by Tarambana
...If not, I'm toast...
You'll never be toast. Toast is his own person, and you can never truly become him, even if you somehow steal his password, because I doubt he'd let you have it.
 

Dris

The Benevolent
Okay, while Safari, Camino, Firebird, etc are a heck of a lot better than IE now, you can't dissavow all credit. IE/Mac was the first browser on earth with formidable CSS1 and CSS2 support. It was a dang fine browser before they stopped upgrading it. MS's Mac development team really helped lead other browser companies in the right direction.

And anytime I hear someone complain that IE/Win renders "just fine" while the Mac version sucks, I wanna rip their balls off, because obviously the problem is with them and their authoring. IE/Win in all forms has to be the most obsolete of the modern browsers, including IE5/Mac.

Anyways, that's my two cents. The suck part is is that MS will indeed continue developing a Mac browser, but it will be the MSN Companion pay service. How am I supposed to know how well that piece of crap complies to web standards? I'm certainly not paying for that.

Okay, one last pseudo-paragraph. Who in their right mind decided that rendering HTML and CSS was best left to an operating system? MS pisses me off beyond comprehension with their system/browser integration. "Gee, why should we have applications with so-called 'purposes'? I have an idea! Let's just make the operating system one big application that does everything!" Eventually, that's what Windows will be, and there will be no need for PC users to buy software from companies other than MS.

That was a rant, I know. I want to die.
 

gwynarion

I stole the Sun
Originally posted by Dris
And anytime I hear someone complain that IE/Win renders "just fine" while the Mac version sucks, I wanna rip their balls off, because obviously the problem is with them and their authoring. IE/Win in all forms has to be the most obsolete of the modern browsers, including IE5/Mac.
I have to disagree with you in part. There are a number of CSS2 positioning things that do not work correctly in IE (Mac or Win). While Mac IE 5 was the most standards compliant browser when it came out you have to remember that it was up against Netscape 4.x. With the advent of Netscape 6 IE lost that claim to fame and it has been loosing ground steadily.
 

Koelling

I Think Different
Again, some one else has pointed out that Microsoft cannot gain access system-level wise (as Apple obviously can).
Saying this is a pretty low blow, even for Microsoft. Apple developed a framework, which anyone can do and they are open sourcing it (I don't know if they have yet since it's not finalized but they will) so that anyone can use it.

There's nothing that Apple has integrated with the system that wont work just as well in anyone else's browser. Just look at OmniWeb, it's way faster now that they are using webcore. Microsoft is just trying to make an excuse for it's own integration into the OS.
 

pyroboy

Registered
People don't use MSN because it's the best way to access the Internet, they use it because of Fear Uncertainty and Doubt (FUD). Look at the commercials and you will see FUD cleverly disguised, but leveled as the major reason to use the software. The Butterfly protects your kids from unwanted things. It stops viruses. It gives you hassle-free, safe browsing.

What a load of bullshit.

But people love FUD because they have been panicked like sheep to herd away from all the scary things. They don't want the viruses, they don't want their kids looking at porn, they don't want all that bad stuff.

The problem is that the bill of goods they are sold is no real protection. MSN filters more messages and has parental block devices, but it also filters out real messages from grandma and blocks access to sites that may not be so bad. You'll still be subject to viruses because people have not learned basic common sense.

I just hope that Apple can get Safari finished and out the door and support it as it should be supported. I am not happy with the job they are doing with Mail. I am still using Eudora even though it is a dead product and has only 3rd party spam tools. It has far superior message editing features and in two versions of upgrades, Apple has still not shown any signs of addressing proper e-mail formatting tools and no, I am not talking about just typefaces, there is far more to it than that.

That is why I am concerned about losing IE. The simple fact is, most Web sites are not going to pay attention to the miniscule marketshare of Safari. Even if every OS X user used exclusively Safari, it would be but a blip on the overall picture of Web Browsers and not really worth supporting. Perhaps if Apple could release a Windows version, it could have a fighting chance!
 

Arden

Where mah "any" keys at?
Despite everything, I get the distinct feeling that there may be something more important in the world than how well a browser renders a web page. Well, maybe not. Long live Safari!
 
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