iPod Video Thread - (speculation, rumours etc.)

Ceroc Addict

Registered
I remember when Sony owned the portable music player market and then got king hit by Apple that delivered, with the iPod, what Sony wouldn't/couldn't at the time.

Now it looks to me like history is getting ready to repeat itself. Maybe not today or tomorrow, but soon, given Apple's stubborn refusal to come out with a video iPod (and a number of solid contenders either being released or already out):

Cowon X5

Creative Zen Vision

Epson P2000

:(

Kap
 

cfleck

tired
Not again. Can we consolidate all the video iPod threads?
 

fryke

Moderator
Staff member
Mod
Well, none of them has a USP it seems to me - apart from a small video-capable screen.

It seems to me that in order to succeed (i.e. to kill the iPod), such a device would need at least two of the three (better all three) following points:

1.) Screen large and bright enough, as well as good battery life and low overall weight to actually view whole movies on (3 hours plus).

2.) User Interface, by which I mean it has to cover audio and video from the bought disk (CD, DVD etc.) to the portable pleasure (including computer). I.e.: I want to buy a disk (CD/DVD), put it into my computer (it gets scanned to the Library of a jukebox like software) and synch it to my portable device, where I can view it. If I start to listen to an audiobook or movie, both synched devices know where I left off.

3.) Accompanying online store... The same software lets me buy tracks, be they audio only or audio and video. The store should let me buy a movie at a quality that's good enough for a TV set or a video beamer. It has to be scalable, i.e. the same file does well on the small screen (without reading the whole 800 MB file, perhaps?) as well as on the HDTV beamer or TV set.

I guess technology just isn't ready for that yet. Apple does good to wait, in my opinion. I don't want the iPod to deliver sub-par video, for example. Imagine you'd buy "Fantastic Four" on the iTunes Video Store in a couple of weeks. You'd pay, say, 20 USD. You'd get a 800 MB H.264 file. Viewable on a video iPod's small screen (320p width? or 640p? actual 720p?) as well as an attached display in HDTV res. Download takes quite a while, right? Now, a year later the iTunes Video Store lets you download the same movie in a higher quality as a 500 MB file. Good? Sure. But all the people who're p***ed off? I guess Apple has a target. They want to be able to deliver a certain quality at a certain size for a certain device for a certain amount of time. That time isn't ready yet - and the list of devices you've mentioned will be a JOKE compared to what Apple wants.
 

fryke

Moderator
Staff member
Mod
cfleck: Those threads are old. Merging them now would, in my opinion, confuse users who read the old stuff first.

If, however, new threads appear _now_, I'll merge them with this one.
 

HomunQlus

Artifical Lifeform
fryke said:
Well, none of them has a USP it seems to me - apart from a small video-capable screen.

It seems to me that in order to succeed (i.e. to kill the iPod), such a device would need at least two of the three (better all three) following points:

1.) Screen large and bright enough, as well as good battery life and low overall weight to actually view whole movies on (3 hours plus).

2.) User Interface, by which I mean it has to cover audio and video from the bought disk (CD, DVD etc.) to the portable pleasure (including computer). I.e.: I want to buy a disk (CD/DVD), put it into my computer (it gets scanned to the Library of a jukebox like software) and synch it to my portable device, where I can view it. If I start to listen to an audiobook or movie, both synched devices know where I left off.

3.) Accompanying online store... The same software lets me buy tracks, be they audio only or audio and video. The store should let me buy a movie at a quality that's good enough for a TV set or a video beamer. It has to be scalable, i.e. the same file does well on the small screen (without reading the whole 800 MB file, perhaps?) as well as on the HDTV beamer or TV set.

I guess technology just isn't ready for that yet. Apple does good to wait, in my opinion. I don't want the iPod to deliver sub-par video, for example. Imagine you'd buy "Fantastic Four" on the iTunes Video Store in a couple of weeks. You'd pay, say, 20 USD. You'd get a 800 MB H.264 file. Viewable on a video iPod's small screen (320p width? or 640p? actual 720p?) as well as an attached display in HDTV res. Download takes quite a while, right? Now, a year later the iTunes Video Store lets you download the same movie in a higher quality as a 500 MB file. Good? Sure. But all the people who're p***ed off? I guess Apple has a target. They want to be able to deliver a certain quality at a certain size for a certain device for a certain amount of time. That time isn't ready yet - and the list of devices you've mentioned will be a JOKE compared to what Apple wants.


The Zen Vision meets your first two requirements.

http://www.dapreview.net/news.php?extend.1784
 

fjdouse

UNIX - Live Free or Die
..and the third requirement is unimportant for some. Never used itms, never intend to either. I can buy my music from an online store in mp3 and put it on any device I like.

I love the shuffle I've been using, but it's my partner's iPod. I've just bought my own media player which does video too and I'm quite capable of backing up my DVDs into a tiny divx to watch on the go. (and I can record TV... and take photos)
 

Shookster

Registered
fjdouse said:
..and the third requirement is unimportant for some. Never used itms, never intend to either. I can buy my music from an online store in mp3 and put it on any device I like.
Fryke was saying that no matter who offers the download service, they'd lack the necessary technology to make it viable for a mass-market audience. That doesn't just apply to ITMS.
 

mindbend

Registered
Wow, a 4" screen! Call all your friends to gather around and watch this year's superbowl.

And just where does one go for content? And is it as easy to obtain as ITMS? And is it a fun, seamless integration into the computer experience or just a hacked on connection?

And, once again, who the hell cares about a 4" screen? I guess I have to concede there is in fact an audience for such a thing (although the jury's still out on that), but I sure hope Apple doesn't lower themselves to producing such a piece of junk. Yes, I'm sure all the examples here work just fine, but it's still just a semi-useless devie as far as video is concerned. You'll never see a 4" video screen from Apple, thank you very much.

I mean, really, is there one single person here that is thinking, man I can't wait to watch some 4" video? Maybe it's just me.

Actually, in all seriousness, I could see having something like that, even as small as it is, to give to my kids in the back seat to shut them up (nah, I'd go with a PSP instead). Other than that, complete junk.
 

sirstaunch

Registered
Ceroc Addict said:
I remember when Sony owned the portable music player market and then got king hit by Apple that delivered, with the iPod, what Sony wouldn't/couldn't at the time.

Now it looks to me like history is getting ready to repeat itself. Maybe not today or tomorrow, but soon, given Apple's stubborn refusal to come out with a video iPod (and a number of solid contenders either being released or already out):

Cowon X5

Creative Zen Vision

Epson P2000

:(

Kap
There's this one, http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=98410&item=5788879185&rd=1

friend just bought it, let ya know of it's performance

$499.99 Aussie Dollar = $375 US Dollars, suspiciously cheap
;)


Oh no, the epson is $499, not to bad i guess in price wise :D
 

Ceroc Addict

Registered
fryke said:
Well, none of them has a USP it seems to me - apart from a small video-capable screen.
USP?

fryke said:
It seems to me that in order to succeed (i.e. to kill the iPod), such a device would need at least two of the three (better all three) following points:

1.) Screen large and bright enough, as well as good battery life and low overall weight to actually view whole movies on (3 hours plus).
I think that's actually 3 separate points :D, but I generally agree. I'd modify these to be:

a. Able to see video clearly (this is a function of the screen quality,
resolution, frame rate, etc)

b. User swappable battery. The technology simply isn't ready to have video
and great battery life at the same time. I'll settle for being able to carry
around a couple of spare charged batteries.

c. Easily pocketable. I think the iPod mini is the perfect example of this
(the regular iPod is just on the acceptable upper limit)

fryke said:
2.) User Interface, by which I mean it has to cover audio and video from the bought disk (CD, DVD etc.) to the portable pleasure (including computer). I.e.: I want to buy a disk (CD/DVD), put it into my computer (it gets scanned to the Library of a jukebox like software) and synch it to my portable device, where I can view it. If I start to listen to an audiobook or movie, both synched devices know where I left off.
I agree, but this isn't even a function of the player/software, it's a function of the extent to which DVD manufacturers, etc. make it tedious to do via
consumer hostile copy protection measures.

fryke said:
3.) Accompanying online store...
This is actually the source of my frustration - because of it's iPod/iTMS successes (and it emphasis on video with the Mac), only Apple is in a real position to move portable video forward. If Apple backed online video, the way they're currently backing podcasting, it'd provide a huge stimulus to both the content creators and consumer portable video market.

fryke said:
I don't want the iPod to deliver sub-par video, for example. Imagine you'd buy "Fantastic Four" on the iTunes Video Store in a couple of weeks. You'd pay, say, 20 USD. You'd get a 800 MB H.264 file. Viewable on a video iPod's small screen (320p width? or 640p? actual 720p?) as well as an attached display in HDTV res. Download takes quite a while, right? Now, a year later the iTunes Video Store lets you download the same movie in a higher quality as a 500 MB file. Good? Sure. But all the people who're p***ed off? I guess Apple has a target. They want to be able to deliver a certain quality at a certain size for a certain device for a certain amount of time. That time isn't ready yet - and the list of devices you've mentioned will be a JOKE compared to what Apple wants.
I think this logic is flawed for three reasons:

1. All devices have an "early adopter" stage. No company get's it perfect
on the first try - remember the first iPod? (no clickwheel, no iTMS, no
support for Audible books on Windows, no support for USB, no dock
connector, etc). As long as they're committed to the product line,
they'll be able to get it "perfect" over a few years. The other companies
that I mentioned earlier in the thread have at least shown that it's
possible to release a decent portable video player with today's
technology.

2. I don't think the market for portable video has anything to do with
watching movies. All the naysayers come out to say "I wouldn't want to
watch a movie on a screen that small
". Well, duh. I can't even imagine
wanting to download a file of several hundred MB to watch on a 2 - 4"
screen. (I've already listed the numerous uses I'd actually have for a
video iPod somewhere on [post=332437]another thread[/post]).

3. I think the device needs to come out first, then the online video store.
Of course Apple can guarantee the quality of video played - others have
already done so (with the only compromise being a user swappable
battery). The files may be big (so big that for a couple of years
people will choose to just transfer video from DVDs, etc), but so what?

Kap
 

mw84

Registered
There's also a new Ipod shuffle alternative, the IRiver 'Domino', a bit more expensive and a lot more ugly. It does have a built in mic, clock and allows you to see what track your playing though.
 

Quicksilver

Find a golden apple.
It would be silly to say no. eventually the iPod or at least Apple will venture into this market. The question is when. In the mean time you could call it speculation.
 

Canada-Man

My team was the Expos
From an article I read today in Montreal's La Presse they say we might be able to buy tv shows and watch them on the "iPod Video" if such a thing ever exists.
 

RGrphc2

...InSaNe...
Taken from Om Malik's Blog and Slashdot :

Slashdot:
Chris Holland writes "Beyond the WSJ Story, Om Malik gives us inside information obtained by Business 2.0 Magazine about the Apple Video iPod. 'Steve Jobs has spoken with Disney President and soon-to-be CEO Bob Iger about ways to license various Disney content for a video iPod, according to an internal Disney email I have obtained. That could include anything from clips from ESPN and ABC News to short cartoons.' "

Malik's Blog
It has been one of those urban myths, that is actually true. Despite fervent denials by Steve Jobs (nobody will take him for his word!) Apple is working on a video iPod, as per the WSJ. My Business 2.0 colleague, Paul Sloan had the complete lowdown, and had been working on this scoop ever since he wrote the big piece pondering what next for Apple, in the April 2005 issue of the magazine. WSJ hints that the video iPod is all about music videos, Sloan has more gory and exclusive details than just that.
Images:


i want one... :) have no practical use for one but still...
 

Stridder44

Universal Traveler
I believe that it is true!


And I also believe that those images are fake, and ugly.


I think that they'll make a PDA type thing though. Unless it has in amazing battery life or something revolutionary about it, a simple device that only plays movies seems kind of a waste...
 

fryke

Moderator
Staff member
Mod
*sigh*... You guys really don't make it easy on moderators... ;) What shall we do? Stick this thread and change its title to "iPod Video anytime soon?" ... Or remove it completely, close it like the other one or merge them all together to some unreadable mix of completely different angles on the always-the-same subject?
 
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