The best and worst political leaders in the world?

Rhisiart

Registered
+ve: Dr Manmohan Singh (India), Vladimar Putin (Russia), Jacque Chirac (OK, just about scrapes through), Angela Merkel (Germany), Groucho Marx (deceased)

-ve: George W Bush, Tony Blair, i.e. poodle to Dubya vis a vis recent microphone recording in St Petersburg (i.e. "Yo Blair, wots up?"), Ta Mok (deceased - total feckin psycho, so good riddance), John Bolton (Us Ambassador to the UN, just slightly right of Pol Pot).
 
Heheh. Agreed. I like this thread already....

best: John Lennon, Mahatma Ghandi, Bill Clinton (socially liberal, fiscally conservative... please disregard the intern under the desk), FDR (New Deal kicks ass)

And... Excuse my ignorance, but what did Jacque Chirac do that was so spiffy?
 
The Ugly Truth: Our President is an Imbecile

You know it, I know it and the American people know it. But everyone is afraid to say it. They say it privately, but people are afraid of saying it publicly because you will be branded as a liberal, elite, intellectual snob. But believe me, you don't have to be an intellectual to see how painfully stupid our president is.

Just look at the conversation he is having with world leaders at the G-8 summit. Mikes picked up the causal talk between the world leaders. Forget that Bush appears to have three sandwiches in his mouth while talking. Forget that he calls out to the Prime Minister of Britain as if he is Flounder in "Animal House." Forget that he uses profanity. I don't give a shit about those things.

What I found to be the most damning is the least quoted part of Bush's comments. As you read this transcript, remember that this is not a small child talking, but the President of the United States of America:

The camera is focused elsewhere and it is not clear whom Bush is talking to, but possibly Chinese President Hu Jintao, a guest at the summit.

Bush: "Gotta go home. Got something to do tonight. Go to the airport, get on the airplane and go home. How about you? Where are you going? Home?

Bush: "This is your neighborhood. It doesn't take you long to get home. How long does it take you to get home?"

Reply is inaudible.

Bush: "Eight hours? Me too. Russia's a big country and you're a big country."

At this point, the president seems to bring someone else into the conversation.

Bush: "It takes him eight hours to fly home."

He turns his attention to a server.

Bush: "No, Diet Coke, Diet Coke."

He turns back to whomever he was talking with.

Bush: "It takes him eight hours to fly home. Eight hours. Russia's big and so is China."

Russia's big and so is China??????? This guys sounds like a third grader. Do you know anyone who would have a conversation like this with their neighbor, let alone a business associate, let alone a world leader? Who's proud to know that Russia is big and so is China?

[...]

If someone is this ignorant, they're usually embarrassed and try not to talk much. But this guy is so dumb he has no idea how dumb he is. This sounds like a conversation you might have with a child, a mentally challenged child. Johnny, do you know how big Russia is? How about China?

This would all be unfortunate if George was your dentist, or worse yet, your accountant. But he is the leader of the free world. This man makes life or death decisions every day. If you say you're not scared about that, you're lying.

Would you let him do the books for your business? Would you trust your company in his hands for eight years? (No matter how Republican you are, you know you just said no to that question.) Would you trust him to be your kids' guidance counselor and take his advice seriously? If your kids were in the Army and he was their field commander, would you feel good about putting their lives in his hands?

[...]

In the old empires, there would be a lot of marriages between the royal families. And from time to time, these inter-family marriages would produce a mentally challenged son who would inherit the throne. This would set the empire back for hundreds of years. I'm not saying anything, I'm just saying. Russia is big and so is China.

The Ugly Truth: Our President is an Imbecile
 
Wow! How do you have Putin as +ve? The guy is as scary as they come, and the rumours are he cut his teeth for the KGB 'removing dissidents' in many parts of the former USSR. Don't think his anti iraq war etc stance comes from some smily happy place. Plus, I'm not big Blair fan but he's better than what preceded him in the UK, and personally I think he's been screwed by Bush rather badly, not that I'd ever vote for him.
 
Living or dead political leaders?

1st shot (living):

Best: Nelson Mandela
Worst: GW Bush, Silvo Berlusconi, Tony (the phony) Blair, any dictator you can think of.
 
Best: Cicero. From then on, it went down, I guess.
Worst: Not born yet.
 
Heheh. Agreed. I like this thread already....

best: John Lennon, Mahatma Ghandi, Bill Clinton (socially liberal, fiscally conservative... please disregard the intern under the desk), FDR (New Deal kicks ass)

And... Excuse my ignorance, but what did Jacque Chirac do that was so spiffy?
Cripes! I forgot Ghandhi and Clinton (in the +ve list of course). Chirac ... well, you may have a point.

Best: Cicero. From then on, it went down, I guess.
Worst: Not born yet.
Cicero's motto was 'To always be the best and over top the rest'. Nothing much has changed then.
 
Well the question, of course, would be what one considers to "be good", rhisiart. ;)
 
Well the question, of course, would be what one considers to "be good", rhisiart. ;)
Yes, good point.

I tend to judge leaders by a simple benchmark: Do their strengths outweigh their weaknesses?

Some are easy to benchmark by this criteria, e.g. Ghandi (good), Stalin (bad). Others are more complex.
 
P.S. My all time favourite political put down:

Lady Aston to Churchill:

If I were your wife, I would put arsenic in your coffee".

Reply from Churchill:

If I were your husband, I would do it myself".
 
P.S. My all time favourite political put down:

Lady Aston to Churchill:

If I were your wife, I would put arsenic in your coffee".

Reply from Churchill:

If I were your husband, I would do it myself".

I always heard this version:

Lady Aston:
"Winston if I was married to you I'd put poision in your tea"

Churchill: "If I was married to you I'd drink it."



Charles de Gaulle had a few gems too: "Je veut mettre Angleterre toute nue!"

Or... How to govern a country with 292 (I forget the exact figure) sorts of cheeses.

Or, "I am not the State, but almost!"
 
I always heard this version:

Lady Aston:
"Winston if I was married to you I'd put poision in your tea"

Churchill: "If I was married to you I'd drink it."
Yes, that's the correct version. I couldn't quite remember it exactly.

I also liked it when Churchill described Stanley Baldwin as an epileptic corpse.
 
Mmm... yeah.... let's add anybody who has anything to do with the advancement of nuclear technologies of any sort.... that's dangerous crap, not only as weapons, but also for "energy."
 
Putin appears to be rectifying the 'mistakes' that Yeltsin made in his drunken stupor. ie Russian Democracy. in the last 6 years, putin has had a hand in buying back most of russias industry. through faceless corporations, the russian government now owns 80% of the industry there again. everyone works for the state now, pretty much. Putin is dangerous. he's rebuilding a broken country quite 'efficiently', as it were.
 
Mmm... yeah.... let's add anybody who has anything to do with the advancement of nuclear technologies of any sort.... that's dangerous crap, not only as weapons, but also for "energy."

that's absolute crap.

> "Iran, you can't have nuclear energy. you can use, er, coal, like everybody else"

>> "but you use nuclear energy"

> "yeah but that's because we're better than you"

>> "how?"

> "um... look, just use coal, ok?"
 
Who DIDN'T sell nuclear technology and other dangerous stuff in this region? Remember Donald Rumsfeld making a deal with Saddam Hussien during the Iraq/Iran War? Classic handshake photo.

Moving on. I think our judgement of political leaders is very subjective.That is normal. But considering the historical context....where the debate will go on long after we are gone, we have to live with those who run our lives at this very moment."Vast program" as Charles de Gaulle once said.
Lincoln, for me, is numero uno...but he is long dead. Like his epoch. History will tell us who was good and/or bad. One thing is sure there will never be a Federal day off for any US President since Lincoln or Washington.And they were far from perfect.
 
You bring up an important point here... While a few citizens might remember some of their countries' past political personnel, I guess most presidents all over the world are forgotten in the world rather sooner than later. Vice-presidents, ministers etc.? Even more quickly. Only a few leave a serious mark in the world's history. And I'd like to see a very simple statistic some day: Are more "baddies" or "goodies" remembered? Because personally, I think that it's mostly the bad guys that are remembered (outside of their countries, I mean).
And then, of course, there's a focus problem. I think some of the best political leaders in the world are those whose names no-one remembers, maybe not even their people. Because their country lived a "boring" life while they ruled. And that's quite often a _good_ sign, isn't it. I mean: No wars, no revolutions, no terrorist attacks, no strikes whatsoever? Boring, of course, but actually the state most people would like the country they live in to be. I wish there was a famous quote of a president stepping down saying: "Nothing happened. I'm glad." ;) I'm still impressed by terms like "Pax Augusta" (Rome was at peace for ca. 200 years after Augustus "created" that peace.). Of course some might say that the long period of peace was also at fault for Roman decadence, which eventually led to Rome's fall... Still I think that it should be a political leader's main goal to create a boring time for his/her country.
 
that's absolute crap

It is NOT absolute crap. ANYbody who encourages the manufacture of such dangerous materials is a bad leader.... be they American, Arab, or from the planet Zorg....

Well... I suppose if the Zorgians figured out a way to safely handle the waste material, then I suppose it would be okay...
 
Good: Jesus Christ
Bad: All the political leaders past and present

Good: Meat
Bad: Tofu

Good: Who's the Boss
Bad: Who wants to be a millionaire

Good: Mac OS 7.5
Very Bad: Windows 95
 
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