Where can I find decent Mac DRM Converter?
- Thread starter scarlet1
- Start date
ElDiabloConCaca
U.S.D.A. Prime
Removing DRM from audio files is illegal (at least in the USA). There are plenty of places on the internet that would be more than willing to help you circumvent the law; however, this is not one of them.
I suggest using Google to find what you're looking for.
I suggest using Google to find what you're looking for.
Rhisiart
Registered
DRMDumpster claims to be able to do this legally, although I wouldn't use it just in case.
Scarlet1,
According to our forum rules, we can not help you to do something that is against US Law even if you tell us it is for your personal use. We would be breaking the law by telling how what to use or how to do it.
You wouldn't want our site to be shut down, would you?
According to our forum rules, we can not help you to do something that is against US Law even if you tell us it is for your personal use. We would be breaking the law by telling how what to use or how to do it.
You wouldn't want our site to be shut down, would you?
ElDiabloConCaca
U.S.D.A. Prime
Yes, the part that's wrong is that you're in a catch-22 situation:
1) You are allowed by law to make a backup copy of your music.
2) You are disallowed by law to circumvent copy-protection and/or DRM to do so.
This is precisely why it's both legal and illegal to make backup copies of your commercial movie DVDs: you are allowed to copy them, but you cannot circumvent the copy protection when you make the copy... but you MUST circumvent the copy protection in order to have a working copy.
Sometimes laws are just screwy.
There are examples of Catch-22 in the law, but this is not one of them. If you were required by law or circumstance to make a working copy of music, then you would be correct. However, there exists no such mandate. Therefore, no one is required to break DRM. As you correctly stated, everyone is forbidden to circumvent DRM.
As for a genuine example of Catch-22, I am aware of a sitting governor of an East Coast State who was required to make alimony payments in excess of his salary.
ElDiabloConCaca
U.S.D.A. Prime
Would it change your mind if I mandated that people make a backup copy?
Oh, well... worth a try anyway. I will tighten my use of that phrase.
I also misspoke when I said that one can make a backup copy by law. I believe that no such law exists, but courts do consider fair- and personal-use situations when dealing with copyright infringement cases, which is why mix-tapes don't get people fined a bajillion dollars by the RIAA (but very well could depending on how many mix-tapes were handed out!).
Hi everyone,
I'm a newbie here, but actually I had the same problem as scarlet1.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is plenty of various software that claims to convert m4p files to mp3's legally.
For instance, I've found this site, as well as many others.
And this software really works well!
So if it is illegal, than why is such kind of soft is sold openly on every corner?
I really don't understand, why can't I use music I paid for the way I need it?..
I'm a newbie here, but actually I had the same problem as scarlet1.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is plenty of various software that claims to convert m4p files to mp3's legally.
For instance, I've found this site, as well as many others.
And this software really works well!
So if it is illegal, than why is such kind of soft is sold openly on every corner?
I really don't understand, why can't I use music I paid for the way I need it?..
ElDiabloConCaca
U.S.D.A. Prime
No, there's not. Just because it's being sold doesn't automatically make it legal.
I don't know, but it's not being sold on every corner of the USA, that's for sure. That site you linked to shows a physical, boxed piece of software. If you can tell me one place in the USA that I can visit (Best Buy, Wal Mart, CompUSA, Target, Fry's, etc.) and pick up that boxed piece of software (or ANY boxed software that strips DRM from audio files), I'll concede that I was mistaken.
You knew when you purchased the DRM'ed music that you would only be able to use it in a certain way. It's clearly explained in the EULA that you agreed to when you signed up for the iTunes Music Store... and no one agrees to any agreement without understanding the terms, right? That would be plain silly.
If you're the kind of person that signs agreements without reading the terms first, I've got several agreements I'd love for you to sign... and a bridge I'd like to sell you, as well.
Ok, then tell me such kind of a thing:
when a burn a cd with those songs, and then rip it - it's illegal too?
Then all cd-rw stuff is illegal as well =))
But if it's, however, legal (and I do believe it is), then why software that just automates this process appeares to break the law?..
when a burn a cd with those songs, and then rip it - it's illegal too?
Then all cd-rw stuff is illegal as well =))
But if it's, however, legal (and I do believe it is), then why software that just automates this process appeares to break the law?..
ElDiabloConCaca
U.S.D.A. Prime
No, that's not illegal.
The reason is that when you burn a CD, you have made a copy for your own, personal use. Sure, the CD has no DRM attached to it -- but when you "rip it" back in, you lose quality.
Same reason using tapes from the 1980s to record songs off of the radio is not illegal -- every copy you make in this fashion has less quality than the source.
No, it's not.
Read the DMCA.
Making a copy of music (or a DVD, etc.) for your own, personal use is perfectly legal (or at least will be looked at with leniency in a court of law). However, the DMCA specifically prohibits anyone from circumventing copy-protection measures in any fashion, including circumventing copy-protection for your own, personal music backups.
That means that making a backup of a commercial movie DVD is perfectly legal, as long as it's for your own, personal use, but circumventing the copy protection on the DVD to do so is illegal... so, in essence, it's impossible to make a legal copy of a DVD that has copy protection on it.
Same goes for music. You cannot circumvent copy protection to make a backup copy.
Burning an audio CD of DRM-protected music then re-ripping it does not fall into any of the above restrictions. That is perfectly legal.
Then again, it's impossible to take a compressed, protected music file and get it into another compressed, unprotected music file without losing quality... that means you can't go from M4P to MP3 without losing quality, even if you burn an audio CD of the M4P files then re-rip them into 320kbps MP3 files -- you still lose quality because of the recompression during the MP3 encoding phase.
Be wary of some software that claims to remove DRM as well -- some of these programs simply "play back" the audio file, then record and compress it into a non-protected format on-the-fly. This is akin to making a tape copy of a tape -- the quality is degraded.
http://www.google.com/search?q=is+it+illegal+to+remove+drm
Don't you think those two paragraphs are contradictory in their nature?
The result is one and the same:
I receive songs in MP3 format for my personal use.
Yes, I lose quality.
But I lose it in BOTH cases (cause the software I've mentioned just minimize that loss, but not revoke it at all).
Frankly, I don't see the difference.
And noone who takes a sober view of things will see it either.
Anyway, I don't want to argue on this matter anymore.
I do believe that those who intend to break the law do not post on the forums to ask how to do that, they know exactly what to do.
And I just hope that such people as scarlet1 will find a way to solve their problem, as well as I did.
Best wishes for everyone.
Thanks all of you!
To be honest I'm a little tired to read your discussions. And I'm confused about ElDiabloConCaca law arguments. So can somebody of you tell me if such kind of software can be sold in the USA (and note that police allow sellers to do this business), then can I use it or not?
P.S. fronda, there is free trial version (is trial version legal or illegal? I don't want to break the law, so I can't write if I use it) of that software. As for me, this way is much more faster then burning CDs.
To be honest I'm a little tired to read your discussions. And I'm confused about ElDiabloConCaca law arguments. So can somebody of you tell me if such kind of software can be sold in the USA (and note that police allow sellers to do this business), then can I use it or not?
P.S. fronda, there is free trial version (is trial version legal or illegal? I don't want to break the law, so I can't write if I use it) of that software. As for me, this way is much more faster then burning CDs.
Neither you nor fronda make sense. The USA does not have a national police force. Our state and local police don't care about violations of the DCMA--except maybe for those in New York, Los Angeles, and Nashville. This, however, does not mean that a poor benighted soul won't get caught and won't be in a world of trouble if he gets caught. People have been caught and have been forced to pay massive fines as a result. Did I mention legal bills? They also have massive legal bills.
BTW, it is standard practice in the US for criminals to trick people into buying things that they believe to be illegal. The street corner vendor who advertises the counterfeit Rolex watch as stolen is just one example.
Both you and fronda are arguing the merits of the DCMA with ElDiabloConCaca. This is a complete and total waste of time. The DCMA is law. EDCC is merely explaining the law to you. The DCMA's merits were argued in the U. S. Congress. It was signed into law by the President of the United States. Your choice is to obey the law or to violate it. Just because you don't like the law does not excuse you from it. If you violate it and if you are caught, then you will have H e l l to pay.
ElDiabloConCaca
U.S.D.A. Prime
Of course I do, and I specifically said that the law is at odds with itself. That's exactly why I explained it the way I did.
You can make backup copies of movies and music.
You may NOT circumvent DRM to do so. You may not circumvent DRM at all, actually.
Since most movies and some music is copy protected, you're going to have a very tough time legally "backing up" those copy-protected media.
This is not my opinion, this is the law. You are not arguing with me -- you are arguing with the law. I have tried to explain it to the best of my ability, but as I said, if I'm not coming across clearly, then you can have a clear understanding of the law by simply reading the DMCA yourself:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Millennium_Copyright_Act
(That is not the actual DMCA, it's just information about it)
Still, my original point stands in reference to the question, "How do I remove DRM legally?"
The answer is the same: "You cannot. Not in the USA."
One workaround (which I will not discuss the legality of because I simply don't know for sure) is to burn an audio CD then re-rip the audio CD (effectively losing quality -- whereas actually REMOVING the DRM would NOT lose quality).
Any software that claims to remove DRM without loss of quality is illegal in the USA.
I don't know how much more clear that can be.
Rhisiart
Registered
That's an interesting statement, especially in light of every sensible point you have made so far.
I don't remove DRM, not just because it's illegal, but I have no need to.
However, if a software claims to remove DRM and in the process causes a loss of audio quality (however slight), is that still illegal?
ElDiabloConCaca
U.S.D.A. Prime
The reason I say that DRM "removal" programs are legal if they introduce some loss of quality is that, typically, these types of programs are simply automating the playback and re-encoding of the music files (which is akin to burning a CD and re-ripping).
These types of programs also "remove DRM" in real-time, meaning it takes 3 minutes and 30 seconds to remove the DRM from a song that is 3 minutes and 30 seconds in length.
Programs that remove DRM very quickly and also do not introduce a level of quality degradation are probably circumventing the DRM in an illegal fashion (much like the now-defunct JHymn program).
These types of programs also "remove DRM" in real-time, meaning it takes 3 minutes and 30 seconds to remove the DRM from a song that is 3 minutes and 30 seconds in length.
Programs that remove DRM very quickly and also do not introduce a level of quality degradation are probably circumventing the DRM in an illegal fashion (much like the now-defunct JHymn program).
Rhisiart
Registered
OK, I understand. I had mentioned DRMDumpster as a software programme that claims to be able to remove DRM legally. If I recall correctly the end product you get with this software is an MP3 file. So this is presumably what you are referring to.