Why make the jump to Mac?

A year after switching I'm still bitterly regretting buying a G4 iBook (Panther, Airport, Bluetooth, 640mb, 60gb) for home use, and will be switching back to PC as soon as I can afford it.

Nothing about this switching experience has been pleasant for me. The hardware is flimsy and unreliable, the software has been prone to crashing a lot, and the user interface feels a lot less flexible and is much more inefficient.

I've taken the machine back twice to dealers (bought by mailorder from Apple) and they briefly tested it on site and pronounced it OK. They warned that if it went back to Apple for full testing and was still deemed normal, I would be charged for looking at it. So I was intimidated to live with it.

After the second time, when I was convinced there's a design flaw in the trackpad, I was suckered into buying an expensive neoprene keyboard cover to raise the fingers so they weren't so likely to trigger the trackpad. (Yes, I've been through all the various system pref settings, don't bother to ask)

I've had to reinstall the entire OS four times in a year - more often than I expect to reinstall XP. And OS management is a lot harder for me. Screen display is fuzzy compared to my analogue Dell display at work. Fonts are harder to read. OS elements are unconfigurable without having to install extra software.

Where do I start about the OSX interface itself? Features that simply seem unusable (e.g. Expose makes me nauseous, I can't use it), software that seems kludgy and doesn't work properly (e.g. both Safari and Firefox don't work properly with a large number of key web sites, and although I have to use Firefox for some of them, it often crashes), inflexibility of the interface (e.g. can't adjust the size of the window elements such as control buttons, lack of word-by-word drag selection). Where do I begin?

I'd never had a Mac before, and I was expecting to be bowled over with delight. I was startled that my experience is the exact opposite. I'm sorry. I still work with PCs, and prefer them by a mile. But there's company politics for me. I borrowed money off my boss to buy my Mac, and he gave me half of it as a gift. I feel oblige to pretend that I like it, at least for the first year.

My heart now sings when I see the Task Bar at work in the morning. Why are there so few people praising the PC and condemning the Mac? I'd say that PC users simply want to get the job done and aren't interested in spending time in a love fest.

Perhaps the Mac really *is* better. Perhaps loving your computer makes you seem like it's more efficient than it actually is. But then Esperanto is 'better' than English. It's not necessarily more useful though.

Your mileage may well vary. If you want to know how Macoholics live and work, by all means get one and learn. It will do your resume good, after all. And you may like it, or even love it. But be cautious. Be even afraid - not of a bad computer - it's not, it's an OK computer. Be afraid that you may well find it a huge letdown, as I did.

Sorry, that's only one's man's bitter personal experience.

Andrew Denny
 
Wow, that's unfortunate. I think a lot of that is a combination of little things that either you didn't do as you "should," or didn't work as they should, and they all added up to give you a bad experience. Which is unfortunate, but such is life... not everybody will love the Mac platform.

I still think Macs do everything better than PC's, even crashing. :)
 
In my experience, a carefully maintained XP install can be just as reliable as OS X. I don't think either company particularly has an edge there. Thing is, it's much easier to mess up Windows with spyware and other junkware than it is to do the same in OS X, mainly for two reasons. The first is that Windows is more targeted by malicious software in general, but another important reason is that X has you constantly running as a restricted user by default. You can do the same thing in XP, but most home users run XP with administrator privileges because many software titles won't run properly in a restricted state. OS X software assumes that you're running as a restricted user by default, which is much healthier for your system.

Another advantage that Apple has is that they're making drivers for all of the system components, and they can quickly release a software update to mend any compatibility issues with the hardware they sell. The typical non-Macintosh PC uses device drivers from five or more third-party companies, and quality is not guaranteed. Shoddy drivers are a leading cause of system failure, and one of the main reasons, in my opinion, why Windows is so notorious for those blue screens. OS X takes most of the steps needed to maintain a stable operating environment by default, whereas Windows XP users need to be on the offensive and apply some of these settings manually.
 
Unfortunate grannybuttons, but hang yourself now or be deemed a heretic...heh.

OS X. Stable. Reliable. Awesome. Virii free.

I mean seriously. For every thing wrong with OS X multiply it by 12 to match XP's flaws.
 
I've used Windows 98 ~ XP I still have the XP box but still spend 99% of the time on my Mac by preference.
The XP was going to be used by my husband but I usually have to chuck him off my Mac as he now prefers it too.
I'm sorry you had problems with your Mac grannybuttons but it is unusual to say the least.
Personally I'd get someone you trust, who knows Mac well, to give it a work out before you give up. They would be able to tell you how to fix up the problems you have with it or if it actually needs sending back to Apple.

Mac OSX 3 is Different, it just does what you tell it to do. I have no problems at all with Safari with the three banks I use, in fact I've only used IE once just to have a look at the Mac version interface.

The third party software programs I have on my Mac are far superior to anything I managed to find for the XP, from Personal Banking to Graphics. Most are FreeWare or Shareware.

If it's Windows that suits you and the way you work, go for it, I for one have never liked or used full screen on either. (The easy way to tell a Windows user)
I think there's room in this world for all Operating Systems, keeps everyone on their toes. This is a Mac site though :)
 
The reasons to switch to the Mac it is, then.

1.) Compared to Windows XP, Mac OS X Panther is far less intrusive to the user. Instead of the computer managing your windows and whether you want to be connected to some chat network (XP does strange things here), the _user_ chooses what to do. Panther's also less hassle overall. No viri, no worms - you just can 'live' with the computer as computing's used to be. Win XP is an eternal fight if you want to keep working with an installation without re-installing and fixing over and over again.

2.) The UN*X base and open source community enable you to do far, far more than just what Apple and some third party developers want you to. But that's just if you're interested. Otherwise, you won't care about it - but you also don't _have_ to care. (Unlike linux.)

3.) Adobe. Macromedia. Microsoft. You can get the most important applications on the Mac, and they usually work better on the Mac, both because the interaction between the applications work better and because the system provides those applications with capabilities Windows just hasn't got - or not in the same perfection.
 
DanTekGeek said:
Because...Mac will never:
...
Refuse to uninstall software.

Hear hear! I've never seen software install and uninstall so easily! I mean c'mon, installing an app in OSX involved nothing more than dragging one file into your Applications folder! It doesn't get any easier! Uninstalling those kinds of programs is also as simple as dragging that one file to the Trash.

Yes, I know there are some apps that have an installer program, but in my experience so far they seem to be the minority. Even major, sophisticated applications can install and uninstall with a single drag and drop in OSX. Freakin' sweet!

As a recent (about 6 months ago) switcher from the PC to the Mac, I wrote up a web page describing why I switched, what I feel I've gained and what I've lost. I put it up at http://freiheit.syntheticdimension.net/floorplan/switch_to_mac.

I also noted my experiences with Linux on the PC which prompted me to buy a Mac rather than continue to suffer at the hands of Linux. http://freiheit.syntheticdimension.net/floorplan/whylinux
 
Granny Buttons:

Your experience is very rare in the Mac community. Certainty sorry you had a bad experience. Sounds like many of the issues can be looked at objectively.
It sounds like you have to keep the laptop. So start picking one problem, and ask people on this board, they are very knowledgeable here.
1) Get a mouse to use instead of the track pad.
2) learn to maintain the OS.
3) What applications are crashing?
 
I'm sorry, Fryke, but my personal experience is almost completely opposite from your argument.

I find Windows less intrusive to the user. It's less hassle overall. I don't have a problem with viruses or worms, but that's because I maintain a virus checker, which is not a great problem to do. I haven't had a Mac virus yet, but I'm risking unprotected OSX. My virus vendor (Sophos) has warned me they are out there. (And I seem to get a 'security update' from Mac every month, only until I got broadband 3 months I couldn't afford the time online to download the updates)

I expect on average to do a complete reinstall of Windows XP every year or so. In my first year of Mac, the Apple helpline has told me to reinstall *four* (!) times, to fix problems they couldn't help me solve by tinkering.

Perhaps part of the reason Windows allows me to do so much more is because there are 30x as many users out there. Don't 'misunderstimate' the power of the greater user base. I don't know any Mac users personally, and rarely come across any on a commercial basis. I have to come on international Mac forums like this, and they are as full of people having problems as my local PC computer store across the road.

Every package I've used on the Mac, I've found just as powerful a solution for on Windows. (With one exception: Graphic Converter (Lemke), which is an astonishingly good photo editor for $30, as powerful for me as Photoshop, but is hamstrung by the OSX interface, which as I've said, is hard for me to use.)

Many people on this and other Mac forums have given me much kind and valuable help for my computer problems, and I'm grateful. But I don't think a truly easy computer should have them to start with, and my Mac problems have been worse than my PC ones, and I feel considerably lonelier about it.

I'm sorry, but my mileage clearly varies *a lot* from yours. All computers have a long way to go. My advice to people like the guy who started this thread, who is familiar with XP and happy with it, is *stick with it* and wait for all types of computer to merge, as they slowly are doing.

(And by sticking to the PC world, they may avoid a lot of the snotty insults like 'M$' and 'Windoze', which seem more motivated by childish tribalism than by an effort to get things done)

Sorry, but best wishes!
Andrew
 
grannybuttons said:
(And by sticking to the PC world, they may avoid a lot of the snotty insults like 'M$' and 'Windoze', which seem more motivated by childish tribalism than by an effort to get things done)

Nah, they'll just get it from all the Linux and xBSD users on x86. :D

Anyways, sorry to hear about your misfortunes. Very rare, as has been mentioned ad-nauseum, but to each his/her/its own.
 
@grannybuttons
Really sorry to hear of your problems with the mac. That hasn't been my experience at all. But do answer Powermac's questions. What apps are crashing (we'll hang the developers ;))? What were the reasons you had to reformat your Panther installation? I did a search of your past topics but there was no indication of any of the problems you're describing.
 
samfrog88 listed these as his main uses:

web design, video editing, and image editing (Photoshop)

Based on that, if you're doing mostly ASP code, it'll be easier on the PC with built-in ASP server. If you're doing mostly PHP, it's the other way around for OS X and Apache.

Photoshop is the same on either platform other some windowing issues that some users prefer on one platform or the other.

Video editing: The Mac is a clear winner here. OS X and QuickTime and the Mac hardware are fully integrated and basically built top to bottom for video editing. Especially on the pro end G5 towers. Every Mac is essentially a turnkey video editing box right out of the gate. PCs can be turnkey, but it usually requires a third pary company. Not that a PC can't edit video right out of the box, but is it HD-ready? What if you switch out your video card, will it break? Is it scalable? Is it fussy with your DVD burner? What if you use a third pary burner? Etc.

These are not concerns on virtually any Mac due to Apple's strict control over all the components and software. The tradeoff is that there aren't as many options (high end video cards for example). The benefit is that they all work without hassle. That's just one example.

-------

Some other issues outside of your specific application needs:

We have five Macs running OS X and two PCs running XP. I find OS X's memory management and drive caching way better. Things don't seem to choke up or slow down quite as much as on XP.

Though OS X's networking still needs a bit of fine tuning, it is very flexible and can basically account for any kind of situation. Same for its file format support and drive mountability. Plug it in, OS X will see it.

One word. Exposé. OS X is better than any other OS for that reason alone. I'm not exaggerating.

Another word. Labels. Still widely underutilized, but unparalleled in their value for those of us who do use them.

Another underused, killer tool: Folder Actions. I have folder actions set on some client folders so when I add a new file, it alerts me to back it up for archival. And another folder that alerts me when I add a new photo I need to keyword it in Portfolio. And another folder action that alerts when a Filemaker DB may be launched, to NOT use that version (otherwise the revision time stamp will change, which screws up our network synching). How cool is that? And this is all very easy to do, with no programming required. I have no idea to program even simple Applescript and I can do Folder Actions easy.

Imagine the above Folder Actions on steroids and you have Automator, soon to be here with Tiger. Create macros for all your apps with Apple-ease, no programming required. I'm all over that.

Use of keyboard control Macro/launchers (e.g. iKey) are much easier on OS X because OS X's alt keys aren't as intusive as on Windows. For example, I use iKey to launch all my applications by using combos like Control+T (to launch Toast). A lot of times you can't do this in Windows because of how the modifier keys are already being used by the OS. At best you have to make long multi-key combos that are really no fun. Subtle things like this allow me to run circles around the most efficient Windows users I have seen to date.

I won't even get into voice control, which I use to launch apps/files and control the OS. When you get good at this, it's really kind of freaky. I have many clients basically go "holy crap". I don't know how well XP does this.

And the virus thing can't be underestimated. Viruses are simply not an issue with me. I use no virus protection because it's pointless. Now because I monitor these forums all the time, I'll be able to quickly see if and when a virus that means anything actually does appear, but for now, it's a NON-ISSUE. NON-ISSUE means I don't even think about it. I don't waste money on virus protection. I don't waste time on having the latest updates. I don't worry my pretty little head thinking, "Hmmm, I wonder if I have a virus." I don't because they don't exist. [knocks on wood].

I could go on and on, but these are a few standout reasons to incorporate OS X. At least do yourself a favor and get a powerful Mac. A Mac mini is not going to set any speed records and may just frustrate you if you're a power user.

Shareware. Yes, there's a bazillion more options for shareware on Windows. This is not a good thing. 99% of it is total junk. You really have to wade through the sea of garbage to get to something that is genuinely decent. Even then, I haven't seen any Windows shareware yet that can beat what I use on OS X.

----------

Now, to be fair, there are some annoyances I have with OS X:

Babysitting interface. When I change a file extension, I know what I'm doing, don't make me approve it. Lots of little things like this that annoy me. Not sure that XP is really any better at this though.

Use of keyboard navigation is not as good as Windows. Every app and every dialog should allow full keyboard navigation. End of story. Better than it used to be, however.

Finder icon previews could cover more formats (like Illustrator).

I personally would really want the summary info at the bottom of a window to include the sum file size of your selection. So, instead of "2 of 5 selected, 27.38 GB available." it would say, ""2 of 5 selected (3.6 MB), 27.38 GB available." This helps when preparing to send email attachments and such.
 
Some people are just not good candidates for the Mac. There is nothing wrong with either them or OS X; there is simply a mismatch in orientations. Intuitive as the Mac platform is celebrated to be, to a heavy Windows user its logic might still seem opaque. Adapting to any foreign environment is never guaranteed to be without its frustrations. As an example of this I am reminded of my own sorry experience trying to learn the Dvorak keyboard. While the layout actually did make sense to me, I found it impossible to "unremember" qwerty, and felt just about as disoriented and frustrated as if trying to write with my left hand. In no amount of time could I ever have adjusted. Similarly, trying to accomplish what should be fairly straight-forward tasks on a PC can me want to tear my hair out.

Of course not every one has the same difficulties as I have dealing with Windows, coming from a Mac back ground, or as Grannybuttons has with Mac coming from Windows, and I'm guessing that any one who has had fun with Linux would be unfazed by any OS. And while I agree with the sentiment, if you are happy now, don't switch, samfrog88 has at least already tried and apparently appreciated OS X; switching, for him, is certainly viable.

But any body who says that Expose nauseates him should stay far, far away from the Mac.

Just my one cent.
 
:confused:

You won't meet a more rabidly pro-Mac person than me, but Exposé is a waste of hard disk space. I prefer to keep my desktop tidy and keep the number of windows open to a minimum so that I can find what I need in a split second anyway.

:cool:
 
OK, here's just one example of how awesome Exposé is:

Ever have a dozen Photoshop files open with a client over your back as you weed through them? Nothing can touch Exposé for quickly organizing them onscreen.

Plus, I forgot to mention, Exposé is much more powerful when mapped to a multi-button mouse.
 
CaptainQuark said:
:confused:

You won't meet a more rabidly pro-Mac person than me, but Exposé is a waste of hard disk space. I prefer to keep my desktop tidy and keep the number of windows open to a minimum so that I can find what I need in a split second anyway.

:cool:

Expose is nice, but it isn't the answer to everything. It works well only for certain types of windows (i.e. the ones with loads of graphics). I use it regularly when I run simulations in MATLAB and my own custom software. Expose really simplifies working with 10 - 20 graphs at a single time.
 
Randman said:
I just have one simple question: Why not switch to Mac?

I find your question great, and often use it myself. The first response a person gives is compatibility. After i dispel that myth, the person goes after the price argument. In fact, that is no longer a real argument in light of Apple's recent pricing. I find that when ever I am involved in a window vs Mac conversation, the PC person usually has myths as their argument. When I ask them your question, they often fumble and can't tell me why they should not use a Mac. :confused:
 
powermac said:
When I ask them your question, they often fumble and can't tell me why they should not use a Mac. :confused:

The answer I always get is "it doesn't support (put the latest game PC game here) latest game like on a PC". It's a lame excuse but it is most always the first excuse they give with the second one being money.
 
Satcomer said:
The answer I always get is "it doesn't support (put the latest game PC game here) latest game like on a PC". It's a lame excuse but it is most always the first excuse they give with the second one being money.

Well, it is not a lame excuse if you are a rabid gamer (which I am not). And macs are for the most part more expensive than the wintel equivalent, though the price can be justified.

Why switch?
  • Streamlined UI
  • Less maintenance intensive than Windows,
  • Dissatisfaction with your current OS or curiosity about the "other OS."

If you are comfortable in Windows, not bothered by the maintenance routine, and have the software you need to get your job done then I would say the only reason to switch is education or curiosity.

I only recently acquired my mac (a month ago today to be precise) but so far I am very happy with it. I still use both my Mac and my Slackware Linux laptop on a daily basis and find advantages and disadvanages to each. Slack is set up well for my needs with multiple different databases, an LDAP server, and a couple web servers for testing.

The user interface on the Linux box is ironically more to my tastes as well. The trick here though is that I spent weeks configuring the interface alone (FVWM2) to do things exactly the way I wanted them done. Then I spent more time getting all the various servers to run correctly on the box, securing the OS, cheking for updates, etc... The Mac was mostly usable out of the box. Many of the functions I need were easily configured from the base OS. The addition of QuickSilver finished the equation for making the Mac usable by me. There are a few servers and client programs that are not available on Mac, but that (plus testing) is why I keep the Linux box as well as an XP box.

From a stock user interface perspective I have to hand it to Mac 10.3 though. I am witholding final judgement for another 5 months but so far I do not regret my purchase.

Two minor annoyances though. Mac uses quite a bit of memory on load. With 1.25 GB of RAM it is not that big a deal, but the purist in me still objects. Second I would like to be able to bind the dock to a key stroke for hiding and unhiding. I don't mind the dock but I would rather it stay hidden unless I tell it to appear. Again, a minor annoyance but I do not like the dock appearing when I happen to move my mouse to the edge it is on.
 
Back
Top